Is John McCain pro life because of

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turbolapp said:
It's still my body...so my choice. Ha. The day you start letting the government make decisions for our own bodies is a mistake.
The government might well decide you're too stupid to breed and cut of your testicles... (If you think I'm being dramatic just look at what happened to the Native Americans)
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Totally agree.

Allowing the government make those types of choices will only lead to trouble.

At the end, abortion may be a "bad" choice in many peoples opinions, however it is still the potential mother's choice. People who get their nuts in a twist over abortion - get over it. People die everyday. Kids, who actually are old enough to decide if they want to die, get shot in drive-bys every fucking day. Were they asked if they wanted to fucking die?

Yes, some things in the world aren't perfect. Go find some made-up god to cry to about it.
 


erect said:
I realize you are trying to prove a point but it's really sad your line of thought excludes the dad from the decision about his kid. Fucking feminazis.
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Sorry, that doesn't hold up either. Yes, it sucks that guys get left of of the final decision but what are you purposing...that they have the man make the final say? It's a medical decision amongst others and that would be like your wife given the right over your own decision about whether or not to operate on your body. Assuming you're of otherwise sound mind and body, how does that make sense?

I would hope that the couple can make the decision together. But if there is a disagreement then someone has to trump and it just doesn't make any sense to have the party that only participated in a split second sperm donation to have the dominating decision.

I never thought I would say this, but you boys need to stop being so emotional. Let's be logical here.
 
turbolapp said:
Sorry, that doesn't hold up either. Yes, it sucks that guys get left of of the final decision but what are you purposing...that they have the man make the final say? It's a medical decision amongst others and that would be like your wife given the right over your own decision about whether or not to operate on your body. Assuming you're of otherwise sound mind and body, how does that make sense?

I would hope that the couple can make the decision together. But if there is a disagreement then someone has to trump and it just doesn't make any sense to have the party that only participated in a split second sperm donation to have the dominating decision.
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disclaimer: I am pro-choice because women who make the decisions to abort would be bad mothers, period.

I didn't propose anything. I just think it's sad that the women of the world look at this entire subject in asinine terms as "it's only your body" or "it's your problem" ... grow up. It's just plain inaccurate as many people (parents, siblings, fathers, etc) are affected by your decisions about your body. It's not just your problem and you shouldn't be the sole decision maker (especially in a pregnant state of mind).

^^ all the above is a plural you not you specifically turbo, you kick TexASS ^^

Since I'm being put on the spot, I'll give a solution: 2 signatures required, either mom/parent or mom/dad (expensive dna test required for this one). I think the last thing we need is for an emotionally unstable woman to make 100% of a decision that affect everyone. There is a reason guys think girls are crazy ... they are most of the time.

turbolapp said:
I never thought I would say this, but you boys need to stop being so emotional. Let's be logical here.
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Says the 8 month pregnant woman
 
turbolap - your arguments don't work. First, forget the law. We are talking about right and wrong. Life or Murder. You can rationalize it any way you want but if you tried using your argument in any other case you would call bullshit!

by the way, the government makes many many many decisions about your body but you don't bitch about them because they don't get to define you as a woman. Boiled down to the core abortion is about power. The feminazis sold you a bill of goods saying you get to choose etc. what it really is about is power over men. You get to make the ultimate decision, life or death, what the man wants be damned.
 
turbolapp said:
The government might well decide you're too stupid to breed and cut of your testicles... (If you think I'm being dramatic just look at what happened to the Native Americans)
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Now this I'm totally for, not sure how I missed it earlier. Lets relate this to IQ also but make it easily achievable .. anyone over 80 IQ is fine

Instead of passing the gov't side of it to big brother (Washington) lets pass it to the penal system as part of a incentive to live a peaceful life.

hard crime ... nuts in a vice or blinder. And you have to watch.
 
turbolapp said:
It's nice you have opinions. But you can substitute opinions for want. (see my sig)

It's still my body...so my choice. Ha. The day you start letting the government make decisions for our own bodies is a mistake.

The government might well decide you're too stupid to breed and cut of your testicles... (If you think I'm being dramatic just look at what happened to the Native Americans)
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I'm really surprised you'd say that. I'll admit my image of you is a little depreciated, given your current status...

By your logic, me stabbing/killing a pregnant woman and killing the baby is simply one count of murder. Unfortunately, the law in all 50 states considers my actions 2 counts.

I think once you take the responsibility to even risk a pregnancy, you're obligated to continue it until full term, unless it endangers the healthy of you, or the baby is the result of rape or incest.
 
losser said:
turbolap - your arguments don't work. First, forget the law. We are talking about right and wrong. Life or Murder. You can rationalize it any way you want but if you tried using your argument in any other case you would call bullshit!

by the way, the government makes many many many decisions about your body but you don't bitch about them because they don't get to define you as a woman. Boiled down to the core abortion is about power. The feminazis sold you a bill of goods saying you get to choose etc. what it really is about is power over men. You get to make the ultimate decision, life or death, what the man wants be damned.
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Life or Murder? So I guess you don't masterbate (assuming you're a guy here) ...I mean you are commiting murder everytime you shoot those millions of little lively cells all over the place and they don't reach their "goal" ...at least by your definition of life which is a bunch of cells...right?

For fucks sake, I can't even continue this arguement it's so ridiculous.

The point is there can only be one solution. You guys can whine about it all you like but the law is there for a reason. You can't make another person do anything they don't want with their own body. Period. Once that baby is disconnected from the body then all the same rules apply to that baby's body and I'll defend that baby's right to life 100%. Until then, you get nothing.
 
For the record, SD is going to vote and likely pass a restrictive abortion law in a few months. We tried a similar law 2 years ago and narrowly missed it due to no exceptions for rape/incest.

We fixed that and listened.

Roe V. Wade is living on borrowed time, and I for one am extremely happy to contribute to it's demise.
 
bb_wolfe said:
I'm really surprised you'd say that. I'll admit my image of you is a little depreciated, given your current status...

By your logic, me stabbing/killing a pregnant woman and killing the baby is simply one count of murder. Unfortunately, the law in all 50 states considers my actions 2 counts.

I think once you take the responsibility to even risk a pregnancy, you're obligated to continue it until full term, unless it endangers the healthy of you, or the baby is the result of rape or incest.
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I've said this before so sorry if it's a repeat for some of you.

I was pro choice before I had my first child. After having a child and having another one on the way, I am ADAMANT about the importance of keeping the choice available. Being pregnant and having a baby is FUCKING HARD. It's hard on a healthy body and can be deadly for an unhealthy one. It's hard on the mind. Even if you manage to get through the pregancy with flying colors, I love the people that come in and say, you could just give it up. You try carrying a baby to term, delivering it and then just giving it up. Fight about 1 million years of evolution and that powerful bonding hormone called oxcitocin. Then, just the first year of sleep lacking, screaming in your ear...it can really drive a normal person insane. Of course 17 more years of upbringing which even if your a good parent you can do one wrong thing and wonder if this is what your child is going to be in therapy for the rest of their life for.

I decided both times I was up for the challenge. I'm strong enough, smart enough, loving enough and I have a great support system. But it doesn't surprise me a bit that some women would not be up to the challenge. Therefore, it's vital that they get to decide for themselves and that should never be taken away.
 
turbolapp said:
So I guess you don't masterbate (assuming you're a guy here) ...I mean you are commiting murder everytime you shoot those millions of little lively cells all over the place and they don't reach their "goal"
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You're murdering kittens you bastards!

2812w8vai1vuxfldr3.jpg
 
turbolapp - that is the all time dumbest thing I have ever read! STOP LETTING PEOPLE AVOID PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY!
If you take the risk of having sex, you have the responsibility to the living growing developing fetus/human to give it a shot at life. THERE IS NO OTHER ARGUMENT, FUCK HOW HARD IT IS ETC. you lost that argument when you got knocked up.
Your notions are selfish and irresponsible(sp?)
We are talking about abortion for abortions sake not extenuating circumstances.
 
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turbolapp said:
I've said this before so sorry if it's a repeat for some of you.

I was pro choice before I had my first child. After having a child and having another one on the way, I am ADAMANT about the importance of keeping the choice available. Being pregnant and having a baby is FUCKING HARD. It's hard on a healthy body and can be deadly for an unhealthy one. It's hard on the mind. Even if you manage to get through the pregancy with flying colors, I love the people that come in and say, you could just give it up. You try carrying a baby to term, delivering it and then just giving it up. Fight about 1 million years of evolution and that powerful bonding hormone called oxcitocin. Then, just the first year of sleep lacking, screaming in your ear...it can really drive a normal person insane. Of course 17 more years of upbringing which even if your a good parent you can do one wrong thing and wonder if this is what your child is going to be in therapy for the rest of their life for.

I decided both times I was up for the challenge. I'm strong enough, smart enough, loving enough and I have a great support system. But it doesn't surprise me a bit that some women would not be up to the challenge. Therefore, it's vital that they get to decide for themselves and that should never be taken away.
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I respect your position and I'm extremely happy you're up for the challenge.

If a 15 year old girl can birth, raise (with help) a child, and make something of her life, 99% of all women can.

Birth is tough, but you're built for it and 6 billion people are alive so it can't be that deadly. The VAST majority of abortions are birth control, not medically necessary.

But I do admire you for being pro-choice and still having kids.
 
LotsOfZeros said:
You're murdering kittens you bastards!

2812w8vai1vuxfldr3.jpg
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Love it ... fuck the kittens

If spermies that don't meet an egg is killing that means that marijuana is a smoking gun because it kills sperm cells. We all know that pot can do no evil so that argument is up in smoke.

I'll keep :rasta: and :rasta: and :rasta: and ......
 
emp said:
Actually, decades of Psychological research (the amount of effort that went into this question is unbelievable) show that intelligence is determined 50/50 between nature (genes) and nurture (how a kid is raised, environment, etc).

So yes, a high IQ couple can have a stupid kid, but genes less likely to affect it too much, because high IQ couples tend to have the means (money, job, social network) to provide a very good environment for the kid.

Stupid parents (to use the layman's term) might give birth to a genetically towards high IQ predisposed kid, but often lack the means to educate it.

::emp::
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Eh, you can find research that speculates that the inheritability of IQ is anywhere from 30% to 70%. The percentage is not as concrete as you make it out to be.

Everyone is stuck on the stupid comment. That wasn't the point, you missed the second sentence. Couples are most likely to have a 100ish IQ child than anything else.

Plus you then get into all kinds of arguments like the validity of different kinds of IQ, tabula rasa stuff, races, etc. Way too much garbage that could be spent on better things.

Sure it does but there are always exceptions to the rule. You are infinitely less likely to have 2 x 130 IQ = retarded than 2 x 65 IQ = retarded ... but I'm not arguing to much on that as this is kind of a no-brainer ... unless your IQ is close to room temperature then your arguement might sound logical.
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If there are exceptions to the rule, then it isn't a rule to begin with. Plus see above.
 
losser said:
turbolapp - that is the all time dumbest thing I have ever read! STOP LETTING PEOPLE AVOID PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY!
If you take the risk of having sex, you have the responsibility to the living growing developing fetus/human to give it a shot at life. THERE IS NO OTHER ARGUMENT, FUCK HOW HARD IT IS ETC. you lost that argument when you got knocked up.
Your notions are selfish and irresponsible(sp?)
We are talking about abortion for abortions sake not extenuating circumstances.
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Sorry, no vagina, no say.

Perhaps they have a whining men's club you could join and sit around naked and bang drums or something?
 
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