AM(A)A: How I Make Money.

scottspfd82

scottspfd82

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Dec 29, 2006
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There was a reply in a thread I started about the lack of "how to make money" discussion going on here lately.

So I've decided to start an "Ask Me (almost) Anything" thread about how I personally make money. Beyond a few rules, any questions are fair game.

First, the rules.

1. I won't say how much money I make. That's my business. I will say that I do well by my own standards. I'm not slinging services or selling anything here. I've been here for 7 years, I like you guys, but I don't rely on you to pay my bills. If you need more proof than that then I can't help.

2. I won't be outing my niches. Feel free to ask about what exactly I do, specific techniques, what I'd suggest learning, etc - but don't expect me to hand you my business. You can apply this stuff to any niche. The strategies are much more important than the industry.

3. I'm not an affiliate marketer in the traditional sense and haven't been for years. There are strategic reasons for that. It's not because I don't know how to create a profitable affiliate campaign, it's because it's not the best use of my time.

4. Some of you know me as a copywriter. There's some truth to that but again, it only applies when it aligns with the strategy. I don't whore myself out for copy, I write copy when it makes sense for me to do so.

5. Leave douchebag replies and other trolling at the door. If you want to learn something, there are no dumb questions. If you want to be an asshat, I'm asking you nicely not to do it in my thread, thanks.

6. If you feel you have a good answer to someone's question feel free to chime in. I'd like to learn from this too - the more experience the better.

7. I have no ulterior motive here. I've learned a lot from this forum and I'd like to give back. I'm not selling anything. I'm not asking you to sign up for my list. That being said, it may take me some time to reply. I don't spend a lot of time on here when I'm working. I appreciate your patience.

8. I'm not a guru. I'm not a millionaire. I party too much. I'm horrible with money. I love staying up late and sleeping in. I sometimes grow complacent and need to kick my own ass. I get bored and burned out often, I switch gears constantly. I've lost everything more times than I care to admit. I procrastinate daily. The list of things that I want to accomplish is a lot longer than the list of accomplishments. I'm far from perfect - and I give no guarantees that any strategies that work for me will work for you. I'm human. I'm flawed. Anyone with an open mind and a good head on their shoulders should be able to accomplish a whole lot more in a lot less time than I have.

That being said, if I didn't feel like I have something of value to offer to a decent percentage of the community here I wouldn't waste my time or yours with this thread.

I think that's everything.

What's your biggest marketing question? What's holding you back? Why aren't you where you want to be?

Ask anything you want, I'll do my best to help out.
 
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ly2 from WF said:
I feel like this thread is either going to go super awesome, or bad on an epic level resulting in bans, doxxing, and rage from Jon.

I am patiently awaiting the results.
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I honestly felt the exact same way before hitting "submit".

But I'm not outing specifics (I'm not an SEO), I'm not selling anything and I don't see any reason why Jon would have any problems with it. If I'm wrong, well, my bad, I'll get banned. I'll live. But I'm hoping we get some great questions and a really interesting discussion.
 
I'm not being a dick, but is it safe to summarize that;

You're not an affiliate marketer
Youre not an SEO
You're not a Guru
You're not selling anything
You might be a copywriter..sometimes.

With that in mind, my question is, what the heck do you do to make money? Are you doing local marketing? Lead gen? etc. If we can learn your forte in this biz, then I might have a few good questions with which to pick your brain. Thx.
 
charlesmartel said:
What exactly do you do?
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A lot of things.

Right now I'm working with a local retail business. I won't say the specific industry but think like $3,500 computer chairs, that's a good comparison. Luxury, high-ticket yet non-essential products marketed towards affluent people.

I basically made a proposal to them that I can make them a lot more money than they're making on their own, I get xx% of all sales I generate. I get exclusive control of their house list, all of their advertising, etc.

So I'm coming in and revamping their marketing. I'm working it from all angles. Direct mail to customer lists. Setup a turnkey referral program to make it as easy as possible for similar businesses to send us customers for a cut. I have massive event based marketing going on in-store, it's perpetual, it's designed so that every customer enters the funnel at the beginning of a big sale targeted at them, with a deadline on when to buy.

I'm giving them a reason why for the sale, I'm doing their direct mail, I'm doing all of the online marketing, Adwords, Bing, FB ads, testing other media as well.

I'm testing and optimizing their sales funnels. I'm tweaking price points. I'm experimenting with offering coupons/bundle deals with related businesses.

I'm doing everything I know how to do to increase their bottom line, and taking a cut of it.

I'm not doing this alone, no one has time for that shit. I'm overseeing a team for a big chunk of the work, but I'm getting my hands dirty with copy and campaigns too.

The pitch from the beginning is that I'm an investor, I know marketing, I can make your business a lot more money - I just want a cut of what I generate for you. It's an easy sale and win-win.

But that's not all I do.

I do a lot of online stuff. I used to create a lot of products, but I quickly learned that I HATE having any business that relies on me personally to create content.

I have a client launching some software this week. I have a strong track record in software launches. This one was done for a flat fee. Normally I work on a fee + % of revenue + access to their buyers list.

The software client reads this forum, I've already mentioned to him that I'd like to manage his buyers list after launch, no fee out of pocket for him, we split revenue 50/50. That's a deal that's in the air though, although there's no downside for him.

I was talking to someone else here yesterday about his product. It's very cool, and I have distribution in place that fits his product perfectly. It's a script/software package. I'd like to work out a deal with him where I either buy a license on a flat fee or rev share basis to rebrand/resell his product under my own brand to different segments of the market.

I'd give you a different answer almost every time I'm asked that question. The short answer is that I like to find existing products, markets, lists and other assets that I feel are underutilized. I then approach the owner, basically say I can help you make more money and take my cut off of what I generate.

So it's really OPM, OPT, OPR (other people's money, time, resources), and I look for areas where I can add value to that equation. That way I don't have to create a product, or find a new market. I can just optimize what people already have. And only get paid on "found money" so it's an easy pitch and win-win.

In the past I've sold hosting, flipped sites, promoted a ton of affiliate programs, done freelance copywriting, managed ad campaigns and a ton of other stuff.

These days I look for deals with hard assets I can tap into, like customer lists, products, distribution channels, JV partners, etc.

It's a lot of stuff, let me know if that makes sense.

Thanks!
 
EricVonDoobie said:
What does it take to make seven figures and why do you think most people fail?
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I really, truly, honestly 100% believe that this is THE most overlooked aspect to business.

The answer to that question is to deliver well over 7-figures in value. And that's easier said than done. But that's the answer.

And again, I'm not a millionaire - so take this for what it's worth.

But I'm a big believer that you really need to look at it from the viewpoint of "how can I deliver 7 figures in value" vs. "How can I make 7 figures"?

I'll use an example from my early days online. I ghost-wrote a book for like $1,000. It became a Clickbank bestseller for my client. It was in the top 10 sellers for years. I take no credit for that, he did an awesome job marketing it and it filled a hungry niche.

I know for a fact that he made over 7 figures from that site.

So looking back, at the time I was new online and thrilled to make $1k for a ghost-writing job.

If I'd negotiated a 10% rev share I would probably have made six-figures.

If I'd negotiated a 50% share I'd have made more. If I'd have negotiated rights to the product (or paid another freelancer to write it for me), and found a similar way to reach a wide market I would have made 7-figures.

Anyway, looking back this guy had no interest in writing. He outsourced the design. He outsourced the copy. He probably outsourced a lot of the traffic buying. The only thing he brought to the table was a vision - and he made big money because of that.

So my advice today - no matter what you do, writing, programming, design... I don't care what it is. You'll go through a phase where you're happy to trade that skill/time for money. That's fine. Learn from those who hire you and find the bigger picture - how are they able to afford your time at wholesale?

And then use that money to bootstrap your way into a position to buy other people's time and talents, and leverage that into something scalable that delivers value to as many people as possible.

That's a big lesson that I've learned. No matter how well paid you are, if it's not scalable, you're not using your talents/time as efficiently as you could be.
 
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I want to add one more thing before I head off for awhile. Why I'm not a fan of affiliate marketing or SEO.

I'm actually a big fan of both, but not for the long-term. I made my first real money online as an affiliate back in 2005-2006. Campaigns exploded and collapsed just as quickly.

My problem with being an affiliate is that you're just doing traffic arbitrage. You lose that edge you lose your business. It's MUCH better to own the offer. To have affiliates driving traffic to build your buyers list. To piggy back off of all of the hard work SEO's put into ranking and drive that traffic to build your business.

These days when I think of being an affiliate, it's in terms of adding another revenue stream to an existing list. Not buying traffic and hoping to earn short-term income off of arbitrage.

You never own SEO traffic. You never own paid traffic. You own lists. You own buyers. You own products. Everything else can easily disappear overnight. Again, I'm not against affiliate marketing. It's a great way to learn the business. For the guys who play it right, it's a great model. But at the very least you should be building your own list, your own assets, off of that traffic.
 
efeezy said:
I'm not being a dick, but is it safe to summarize that;

You're not an affiliate marketer
Youre not an SEO
You're not a Guru
You're not selling anything
You might be a copywriter..sometimes.

With that in mind, my question is, what the heck do you do to make money? Are you doing local marketing? Lead gen? etc. If we can learn your forte in this biz, then I might have a few good questions with which to pick your brain. Thx.
Click to expand...

1. "You're not an affiliate marketer"

Not in the "signup and test traffic" sense. At least not usually. Normally my affiliate thought process goes "okay, these people just bought "x", they probably need "y" too. If I help them find a great deal on "y", I'll add value to their lives, they'll appreciate it and I'll make more money too."

2. You're not an SEO.

No. I'm very familiar with the industry. I stay up to date on techniques, etc. But it's not something I handle myself. I remember reading BlueHatSEO.com a long time ago and realizing that's not where my skill set is. I think SEO is a great skill to have. It's scalable. It's extremely valuable. But it's not for me. I'd rather let those who are better at it than me handle it.

3. You're not a Guru


I'll admit that this is subjective. I'm a big believer in preeminence. Meaning, if I tell someone I can grow their business, I'm going to prove it to them. I'm going to come across as the expert. I won't approach them unless I'm 100% confident in my abilities to do so. So there's an aura of confidence you need. You need to be that trusted adviser. And you can't fake it. As far as working with clients, maybe I do play somewhat of the roll of "guru". But posting here, I'm not an "online guru" trying to peddle rehashed bullshit to you guys.

4. You're not selling anything

I'm trying to give back to a community that really helped me to get started. I may earn some goodwill, or make a new contact, but I'm not expecting to and that's not the goal. I won't be sneaking a sig link or anything into this thread. And I don't have any courses to sell you.

5. You might be a copywriter..sometimes.

Copywriting is just selling in print. When I'm working I'm always selling. There's a lot of copy that I won't outsource, so I end up writing a lot myself. That's okay though, I enjoy it.

With that in mind, my question is, what the heck do you do to make money?

I hope I clarified that in the earlier post. In short, I look for win-win opportunities. And most of the time they're not 100% online. There's a lot of money in local businesses if you keep your eyes open.

Hope that helps.
 
Andrew Scherer said:
What you're doing reminds me of what Jay Abraham does (besides the marketing info stuff)
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Yep, I'm a HUGE fan, and would recommend that anyone in marketing study him. I'm also a big fan of Dan Kennedy, Bill Glazier, Gary Halbert, Robert Ringer, A LOT of old school marketers/copywriters (Gary Bencivenga, David Ogilvy, Eugene Schwartz, Clayton Makepeace)...

...Some current guys I listen to/study are Ben Settle, Clay Collins, Jason Fladlien (sometimes), Craig Garber, Doberman Dan, Rich Schefren, Michael Senoff...

Too many people to mention. I'm always studying someone. I'm obsessed. I'd rather study marketing than watch TV or listen to music.

That's a good shortlist of guys I pay attention to though.
 
Damn, you work hard bro.

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lukep said:
Damn, you work hard bro.
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I appreciate the comment, but you bring up another great point.

I do work hard sometimes. But the real beauty is making money when you no longer have to work hard.

The real beauty is when you systemize this stuff.

For example, the retail biz, I'm doing a lot of copy work myself. I *could* outsource it but it's an industry I know well and I don't know a writer I trust with the copy.

But I don't write the copy.

I've been writing copy long enough that I know basically what I want to say. I'll write a short outline of a promo in a mindmap. And then I'll just do an impromptu pitch by talking/recording it. It takes maybe 3 minutes.

I'll have that transcribed and edited, and then returned back to me. Another 15-20 minutes of editing/polishing and it's a package ready to go. A package I can use over and over again, that I own completely.

I outsource or automate everything that I possibly can. Hell, even transcription, I have a Ruby script to auto-submit it to Mturk and then paste the transcription on my desktop.

Landing pages, etc, I have all templated out so I can just plug copy in and deploy them.

I do my best to systemize everything. Most campaigns I can swipe a template I have and quickly repurpose it for something else. The system I'm building for this store, I own it. It's designed to be perpetual. I build it once and it can be used for years.

I'd say that my biggest weakness is that I work too much. I rarely outsource copy. I don't like outsourcing sales/client relations. That's one thing I'm always working towards is systemizing/automating/outsourcing as much as possible without sacrificing the value I'm delivering.

I'm getting there. But at the same time I enjoy the "work" too, it's a blast for me, so no complaints. IMHO, hard work is critical to success, but over time you should work on systemizing things so you can still get paid when you're not working hard.
 
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I like how you talk about equity and ownership and being the most important factors to consider in business and agree with you that at the end of the day AM is not stable, you are just a middle man and you don't own anything unless its your CPA offer you created but even then its not as stable and you can't sell an offer really.

I really like this thread and don't have a question yet but when I do I will post it just think this is great you are doing this. thanks plus rep
 
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