Hydra Layoffs

[PhillipMarlow]

"despite the fact that we will assimilate your minds into our corporate borg beehive consciousness. Well actually, that will be optional."

It's funny that he says this tongue-in-cheek...when we all know goddamn well that that's EXACTLY what it would be like working for a company like this.

 

[abbywhitridge]

so now that all the good people from Hydra are at w4, anyone worked with them?

First off, I'd like to pass along my condolences to the Hydra people who were let go. I worked closely with many of those individuals during my tenure at Hydra and found them to be dedicated, hard workers.

And for those of you who may be interested:

After leaving Hydra, I started W4 with 3 of the co-founders of Hydra, Jason Walker, Adam Walker and Doug Walker, who had been manipulated off of Hydra's Board and terminated by Hydra without any justification (but apparently in part to silence Jason's repeated demands that Hydra change its cookie timeout practices that had been the subject of many customer complaints). As best as I can tell, Hydra hasn't changed, its business is faltering and its employees are leaving and/or being fired in droves.

As if ousting the Walkers was not enough, while they were working with me to get W4's network up and running, Hydra launched a full-scale legal attack to stop the Walkers from competing with Hydra. Hydra came straight at the Walkers claiming that they were violating an agreement they signed in 2006 that claims to stop them from competing. As some of you know, non-competes aren't enforceable in California. The exception is when a company sells all or substantially all of its stock or assets to a new owner. Kayne Anderson Capital bought 16% of Hydra in 2006, which Hydra's army of attorneys succeeded in convincing a Los Angeles judge was a sale of Hydra's entire business! The Walkers are appealing the decision -- which is flat out wrong -- but in the meantime they are legally barred from working in our industry until March 2011. In fact, Hydra's order prohibits the Walkers from working for any company that engages in online advertising. Unbelievable! In the end, I am confident the Walkers will prevail, but as far as I am concerned Hydra is being run by cowards that resort to legal tricks to avoid fair competition.

They still have to contend with me, and I will continue running W4 (more like W1 these days). We have a strong team and will start to do business in the next few weeks. Check us out at W4 and feel free to be in touch so we can make some money together in the near future!

Abby Whitridge

 

[Volume10]

and there you have it.

 

[Rasher]

First off, I'd like to pass along my condolences to the Hydra people who were let go. I worked closely with many of those individuals during my tenure at Hydra and found them to be dedicated, hard workers.

And for those of you who may be interested:

After leaving Hydra, I started W4 with 3 of the co-founders of Hydra, Jason Walker, Adam Walker and Doug Walker, who had been manipulated off of Hydra's Board and terminated by Hydra without any justification (but apparently in part to silence Jason's repeated demands that Hydra change its cookie timeout practices that had been the subject of many customer complaints). As best as I can tell, Hydra hasn't changed, its business is faltering and its employees are leaving and/or being fired in droves.

As if ousting the Walkers was not enough, while they were working with me to get W4's network up and running, Hydra launched a full-scale legal attack to stop the Walkers from competing with Hydra. Hydra came straight at the Walkers claiming that they were violating an agreement they signed in 2006 that claims to stop them from competing. As some of you know, non-competes aren't enforceable in California. The exception is when a company sells all or substantially all of its stock or assets to a new owner. Kayne Anderson Capital bought 16% of Hydra in 2006, which Hydra's army of attorneys succeeded in convincing a Los Angeles judge was a sale of Hydra's entire business! The Walkers are appealing the decision -- which is flat out wrong -- but in the meantime they are legally barred from working in our industry until March 2011. In fact, Hydra's order prohibits the Walkers from working for any company that engages in online advertising. Unbelievable! In the end, I am confident the Walkers will prevail, but as far as I am concerned Hydra is being run by cowards that resort to legal tricks to avoid fair competition.

They still have to contend with me, and I will continue running W4 (more like W1 these days). We have a strong team and will start to do business in the next few weeks. Check us out at W4 and feel free to be in touch so we can make some money together in the near future!

Abby Whitridge

best first post ever.

 

[Roundabout]

Yes we had some layoffs but the number is wrong and the reason is wrong.

Mason,
Speaking personally, we worked with you guys for several years, and continue to, however our inventory allocated to you guys has gone down signfiicantly over the last year, dramatically over the last few months.

You need to take a very close look at some of your advertisers, especially your biz opp ones. Your network has some of the most shaved biz opp offers I've ever run across. I know it's not my data, because I use the same lists for 6-7 other networks and it performs extremely well on similar biz opps.

Sure, there's evidence of shaving from the other guys, but at least they allow some conversions and know how to properly string me along. I've run several of your offers recently, and generated thousands of clicks per day and made $0. I got so fed up I turned off inventory entirely for biz opps.

On a positive note, other niche offers on your network perform very well, so all hope is not lost.

I found it very unusual 2 of your AMs called me just to discuss the biz opps and to give me an online survey asking me to comment on the conversions. I had a strong hunch they were VERY aware of shaving going on, and wanted to hear it directly from the publisher. Well, they heard it, but until I know the issue is resolved, that lucrative niche is off my plate for the time being.

 

[Volume10]

best first post ever.

Abby is a baller.

 

[rgordon83]

leah?!

She was my AM when i used to run traffic there. She was pretty good i think. But havent run any traffic with them in at least 5 months...

 

[masonwiley]

Ugh, where to begin...

I worked closely with Abby and like her a lot, and have worked with the Walkers at 2 companies. They in fact brought me into Hydra. But wtf?!!!

Business is business. Yes, there is a legal battle going on. But legal battles and business go hand in hand. I am not involved in this one - thank god. But it seems to me both sides will have their day in court, present their sides of the story, and the law will decide.

Putting out a one-sided view in a public forum seems irresponsible to me and obviously intended to throw Hydra under the bus. Of course Abby is free to lash out against those she doesn't like. But it hurts all of us - her dedicated former peers whom she does like and who like her. Is it a good thing to attempt to put all of us out of work to get payback against one? Not in my book.

The reality is there are 2 sides to every story. For example, some of the people let go who Abby applauds as hard workers she wanted fired when at Hydra. Whatever...

The fight between the owners is a fight between the owners. It does not impact what we do as a company. It's irrelevant as far as i am concerned.

I, like all the rest of us at Hydra, are just keeping our heads down and trying to do our best to make a living by making money for the affiliates and advertisers we serve... and to build the company by providing more added value.

As for the truth? Hell, I was there for a lot of it and even I don't know the whole truth.

And another thing to all of you who throw out this idea that Hydra is getting all corporate as some evil thing. Yeah we are getting more "corporate" in the sense that we are adding business processes to run more efficiently and error-free. We are also sharing our business plans with the entire staff so all know what's going on more than ever before. We are delegating more responsibility to empower our managers. Hydra is too big to fly by the seat of our pants or have only a few making all decisions.

So there's a whole bunch of transparency for you. I am sure plenty will still say fuck Hydra. That's your right of course. But you will be saying it based on only a tiny portion of the facts or even deliberate misinformation.

If you have real issues or problems with the way we do business, bring them up with me or whomever you work with at Hydra. I guarantee we will do our best to fix whatever's broken.

 

[masonwiley]

You are just wrong

Your network has some of the most shaved biz opp offers I've ever run across.

We have been in business 6 years and do not shave offers. Period.

 

[kingrage]

Business is business. Yes, there is a legal battle going on. But legal battles and business go hand in hand. I am not involved in this one - thank god. But it seems to me both sides will have their day in court, present their sides of the story, and the law will decide.

Firing someone and then banning them from working? Sounds like fundamentally and morally strong business practice.

 

[jvincent]

honestly my main concern with working with hydra these days is just that I perceive it to be unstable. the founders are beefing. staff are getting fired and laid off like mad. the other hydra hate thread didn't help much despite their clearly being a 2nd side to the story....

it really just comes down to a matter of trust -- can i trust that i'll be paid, always, by hydra. with so much uncertainty/instability, it'd be difficult for me to see benefits of signing up w/ hydra vs another network.

not trying to be a dick, just stating my opinion.

 

[Sonny Forelli]

honestly my main concern with working with hydra these days is just that I perceive it to be unstable. the founders are beefing. staff are getting fired and laid off like mad. the other hydra hate thread didn't help much despite their clearly being a 2nd side to the story....

it really just comes down to a matter of trust -- can i trust that i'll be paid, always, by hydra. with so much uncertainty/instability, it'd be difficult for me to see benefits of signing up w/ hydra vs another network.

not trying to be a dick, just stating my opinion.

this is what companies fail to realize. Many of us (most?) are self-funded, and speaking personally the risk:reward calculation of possibly making another 10-15% profit but possibly not being paid well into the 5 or even 6 figure range is very concerning. Networks- step back and think about that for a second- if an affiliate is running a campaign that does $100k/week in revenue what do you think the profit margins are? They're probably larger than we're making them out to be or you're assuming they are, that is, they're comfortable and another 10% to switch to a different network that we're not 100% confident in is crazy. All you need to do is estimate the percentage chance of not being paid and you can easily back out the net gain/loss of the move from network a to network b.

My comment has NOTHING to do with Hydra specifically, but I completely agree anything but 100% confidence has me looking elsewhere. Yes- I can get the same offer elsewhere. No at the volumes I'm running I really couldn''t care less about an extra $1. Not to mention- you toss in a little shaving (at the advertiser level- but specific to network ____ versus network _____) and I can blow thousands of dollars in a few hours of testing only to find out this overly excited AM is really getting fucked on the offer.


Adapt and survive, but I'll steer clear of all involved parties past and present involved in this tiff due to the ridiculous nonsense all over WF. It simply isn't worth risking my money.

 

[Supergeek]

Non-competes are lame.

 

[Roundabout]

We have been in business 6 years and do not shave offers. Period.

Re-read my post, I never claimed Hydra shaved, I claimed you are partnering with BizOpp-Advertisers who shave.

You're not the brightest fish in the Hydra aquarium, is ya?

 

[anoko]

Marketleverage too need some reorgainization. I would be happy to see some people layed off there.. Specially Dan Stack and Melissa Clarady

 

[Seema]

We have been in business 6 years and do not shave offers. Period.

LIES.

Exhibit A

Exhibit B

 

[mediaaff]

LIES.

Exhibit A

Exhibit B

Is this a rebill offer? The conversion rates are pretty weak...

 

[cardine]

LIES.

Exhibit A

Exhibit B

Were you split testing with another offer on another network? Did that offer also have a similar fall in conversion on the second day?

If you didn't do that, there is no way for you to say definitively that Hydra was shaving simply because conversions fell from day 1 to day 2. There are hundreds of other things that could've caused that.

 

[tjewsky]

hundreds of other things? like what?

Assuming you keep the traffic the SAME ... then I say that the advertiser turned on the shaver (not Hydra)

 

[ap121]

Nicole is fired too? I couldnt find her on AIM today..