Obama moves to nationalize higher education

Quit whining about "for-profit" colleges unless you're going to stand by your principles and refuse to promote education offers.

As for me... I have no problem with (legally) separating a fool from his money.

Free market, baby!
 


Something that has been missed so far in this thread is, Obama hates all industry that is for profit. This is really nothing new. Regardless of what industry makes money, Obama is against it and wants to regulate it. Think health care, banks, Oil, college, insurance, wall street, Las Vegas, the list goes on.
 
kingfish said:
These schools are fine they provide a service and training but don't hold your fucking hand all the way to a 6 figure income. They provide you with the training you need to get starting in an industry where if you work hard and keep learning and take personal responsibility you can succeed. I find it sad that no one in this country seems to believe in personal responsibility anymore it's always someone else's fault if they fuck up their lives.

If there is lies in their marketing then that's where the problems are and that's where they should be addressed.
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Awesome post. I guess people think spending the money is the only thing necessary for a right of passage in life.

Enough of the fucking blame game. It's just so fucking irritating.

At the same time, many career college certificates don't hold the weight that a degree from a prestigious university or college do. It still comes down to the individual and their decision to go to that school, take that course, not learn the people skills necessary to get a job, etc.
 
mccain-topper.jpg

I voted McCain.
 
Colleges are arranged on tiers and businesses and those in academia know very well which colleges and universities are worthwhile and which aren't. There is a huge amount of value in a "real" college degree from a high level program. Of course the typical student and his parents have no clue what they are really paying for if they aren't in the real colleges.

There is almost no value in a crap degree and that has been the case for decades. The internet and for-profit school just took the crap degrees and made them more common and accessible. Most of these programs aren't accredited and will earn you a lot of laughs behind your back when you list it on your resume.

Of course some of them have some value. I'll take a crap masters degree in school administration because I just need the piece of paper to couple with years of experience to move up. But when I do my doctorate in a few years, I'll likely be heading to UT or the like (again) because there is no way I'm going to apply for a professorship without a "real" degree backing me up.

As far as Obama making it mandatory - there is a lot of lip service paid to what's mandatory and not in education all ready, so this isn't especially shocking. I'm all for raising standards and learning, but about 90% of colleges today are a joke - and that goes for many universities both online and off that have been a joke for decades. Think of anything considered a "party school" or one with "easy admissions" and you'll know which ones I mean.
 
I'm all for personal responsibility and I've never been a fan of Obama but I think government backed student loans at all universities should be linked to income potential. If a student can't reasonably expect to be able to pay back government backed student loans then they shouldn't be able to take them out in the first place.

Some degrees aren't worth the paper they are written on and my tax dollars shouldn't go to subsidize them. If for profit schools turn out students that don't make enough money to justify the cost tax dollars shouldn't be used to subsidize education at them.

There are two real issues with university of Phoenix type places.
1. Employers think the degree is worth less than traditional degrees meaning students on average earn less with a university of Phoenix degree than students at traditional schools.
2. Many for profit schools have abysmal graduation rates and I think most people realize that a half finished degree is essentially worthless regardless of the school you went to. Low graduation rates further decrease the average earnings of for profit school students.

While I like this program it really doesn't go far enough it should target by school and degree program rather than just the school. So students are forced to differentiate between degrees based on ROI if they want to get government grants or subsidized student loans.

To many kids go to college thinking that any degree they get will be their ticket to a middle class life and that simply isn't true.
 
kingfish said:
These schools are fine they provide a service and training but don't hold your fucking hand all the way to a 6 figure income. They provide you with the training you need to get starting in an industry where if you work hard and keep learning and take personal responsibility you can succeed. I find it sad that no one in this country seems to believe in personal responsibility anymore it's always someone else's fault if they fuck up their lives.

If there is lies in their marketing then that's where the problems are and that's where they should be addressed.
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That sounds like a MLM scheme.. they provide you with products, training and the potential to earn a 6 figure income if you take personal responsibility and sell the product and create a downline, but if you fuck up its your fault not the product or the company!
 
I went to DeVry on a FISL (Federally Insured Student Loan) and even got some cash from a BEOG (Basic Educational Opportunity Grant) to cover books. I did it after some slick sales guy came around and sold me on the sure thing of a good paying job for 95% of DeVry grads.

Ya know what? They delivered. EVERYBODY who graduated in my class had multiple job offers. I made decent money, paid off the loan, bought the toys, eventually the house.

Times have changed. Maybe a lot of those schools are utter crap now. For sure I wouldn't buy today from that sales guy who sold me years ago. But back in those days (olden times for a lot of you grubby little kids) they delivered and I did pretty damn well from it.

Nationalized anything is a disaster. Glad I escaped the U.S. when I did.
 
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