Yeah isn't Japan the 3rd biggest economy next to united states and china? I was coming home from work yesterday. I work nights so it's 6 something AM, I was going to get gas and I noticed the gas station was packed, never saw that many cars there that time of day. Later when I came home and learned about the tsunami I'm guessing people were gasing up before the sure as shit gas hike hits.
8.8 Quake
- Thread starter conjamuk
- Start date
Ya you know what your talking about. The japanese economy is in a funk for 10 years but their yen is more solid than US dollars.
They actually care about their citizens and have strong yen policy:
Yen to US Dollar Exchange Rate Graph - Mar 6, 2006 to Mar 4, 2011
Unlike USA that dumps the dollar to try to make exports look cheap and to slowly fuck the sheeple.
Japan is a powerful country though, I'm not too worried. Top class Engineering and Architecture. They'll bounce back quicker than we think. It's when this shit happens in Haiti or Sri Lanka that I go like "oh fuck"
It seems reactor #1 has melted down , and the venting of built up hydrogen gasses caused a explosion at a sheet metal containment building.
Nothing to get worried about really, the dosage is so a amazingly low, plus this is a western-style PWR which means very little danger.
What's even more amazing is the plant got hit by a 8.9 earthquake & a tsunami and 3 of the 4 reactors are just fine.
Nothing to get worried about really, the dosage is so a amazingly low, plus this is a western-style PWR which means very little danger.
What's even more amazing is the plant got hit by a 8.9 earthquake & a tsunami and 3 of the 4 reactors are just fine.
This is from someone that is very well versed on this subject and has personally worked on this crap:
Yesterday:
Most of what you are hearing about the nuclear plants is a combination of ignorance and fear-mongering. All the plants in the affected area shut down automatically for safety reasons. Only one of them is problematic. The reactors in the rest of the country are running normally, and many of those now shut down will be back up and running as soon as there are enough intact power lines to justify running them.
The Fukushima Daiichi plant is problematic. Mechanical damage knocked out its primary cooling system and damaged the backup system. The tertiary (emergency) system is available, but will only be used in an absolute emergency because it contains borated water that would put the plant out of operation for a very long, expensive time. It is a boiling water plant with a pressurized fuel tubing system similar to the Russian RBMK reactors made infamous at Chernobyl, but even the notorious Chernobyl-4 reactor was an inherently stable and relatively safe design except during startup and shutdown, and it only blew up because the operators did unimaginably stupid things. The Fukushima reactor is already shut down and stable, but while inadequate cooling creates adverse temperature and pressure conditions that would be remarkably dangerous if the reactor were operating, the decay heat from a shut down reactor is probably inadequate to produce a Chernobyl-type explosion. The worst case scenario is that the core could be damaged from overheating, requiring a prolonged cleanup expensive in both dollars spent and in radiation exposure to workers doing the repairs.
The rumored venting of radioactive steam will reduce the pressure within the core, making possible the use of the tertiary cooling system, which operates on a gravity feed system (anticipating loss of all power) but whose flow rate could be inhibited by a steam bubble in the core (as we experienced at 3 Mile Island Unit 2). I would assume that they will wait until the wind is blowing out to sea, but the chances of the steam causing any major problems over land are not all that serious as long as the fuel tubes have not burst yet. If the fuel tubes have already burst, then they are already deep into the same situation we faced at TMI-2. That isn't good, but it is nothing compared to what happened in Idaho in 1961 or at Chernobyl in 1986, much less Nagasaki in 1945.
This is his update today:
I don't put much stock in media reports of increased radiation levels because journalists seem to get the units of measure confused. Did they take that reading in sieverts, becquerels, rads, rems, or curies? The numbers in each unit are not comparable, any more than comparing numbers of miles, gallons and tons. Also, are the numbers higher compared to normal background at the same spot, or just higher than should be expected at any random spot on earth? Are the numbers being compared to readings near an operating or shut down reactor?
Regarding the explosion at the power plant, that could mean anything from a steam explosion that ripped apart the core and coolant piping, to a turbine explosion and lube oil fire unrelated to the shut down reactor, to a reserve diesel fuel containment going up due to a downed power line and static electricity. Even if the reactor blew Chernobyl-style, this plant has a pretty comprehensive containment system to keep all the mess in one spot.
The only thing that concerns me about those reports is that they've detected cesium downwind. That indicates that the fuel cladding has been compromised and uranium oxide fuel has mixed with the coolant water, evaporated to steam, and in some small quantity been released beyond the containment facility. How much has been released is impossible to know right now from media reports, but any release is not good at this point, and indicates that they've already got at least a partial meltdown underway. As long as they aren't dumb enough to let the byproduct hydrogen build up, and as long as they stop venting radionuclides to the atmosphere, a meltdown still just means a protracted and expensive cleanup with long-term loss of power generation (TMI-2 experienced the same thing in PA in 1979 and has never been put back in service). If they screw around with the hydrogen, though, and if they don't find a way to stop letting cesium out, this could get ugly. By now they should be well past the point of unforeseen cascading casualties, and out to have time to get a plan into place instead of just reacting to the moment without thought of the eventualities.
Yesterday:
Most of what you are hearing about the nuclear plants is a combination of ignorance and fear-mongering. All the plants in the affected area shut down automatically for safety reasons. Only one of them is problematic. The reactors in the rest of the country are running normally, and many of those now shut down will be back up and running as soon as there are enough intact power lines to justify running them.
The Fukushima Daiichi plant is problematic. Mechanical damage knocked out its primary cooling system and damaged the backup system. The tertiary (emergency) system is available, but will only be used in an absolute emergency because it contains borated water that would put the plant out of operation for a very long, expensive time. It is a boiling water plant with a pressurized fuel tubing system similar to the Russian RBMK reactors made infamous at Chernobyl, but even the notorious Chernobyl-4 reactor was an inherently stable and relatively safe design except during startup and shutdown, and it only blew up because the operators did unimaginably stupid things. The Fukushima reactor is already shut down and stable, but while inadequate cooling creates adverse temperature and pressure conditions that would be remarkably dangerous if the reactor were operating, the decay heat from a shut down reactor is probably inadequate to produce a Chernobyl-type explosion. The worst case scenario is that the core could be damaged from overheating, requiring a prolonged cleanup expensive in both dollars spent and in radiation exposure to workers doing the repairs.
The rumored venting of radioactive steam will reduce the pressure within the core, making possible the use of the tertiary cooling system, which operates on a gravity feed system (anticipating loss of all power) but whose flow rate could be inhibited by a steam bubble in the core (as we experienced at 3 Mile Island Unit 2). I would assume that they will wait until the wind is blowing out to sea, but the chances of the steam causing any major problems over land are not all that serious as long as the fuel tubes have not burst yet. If the fuel tubes have already burst, then they are already deep into the same situation we faced at TMI-2. That isn't good, but it is nothing compared to what happened in Idaho in 1961 or at Chernobyl in 1986, much less Nagasaki in 1945.
This is his update today:
I don't put much stock in media reports of increased radiation levels because journalists seem to get the units of measure confused. Did they take that reading in sieverts, becquerels, rads, rems, or curies? The numbers in each unit are not comparable, any more than comparing numbers of miles, gallons and tons. Also, are the numbers higher compared to normal background at the same spot, or just higher than should be expected at any random spot on earth? Are the numbers being compared to readings near an operating or shut down reactor?
Regarding the explosion at the power plant, that could mean anything from a steam explosion that ripped apart the core and coolant piping, to a turbine explosion and lube oil fire unrelated to the shut down reactor, to a reserve diesel fuel containment going up due to a downed power line and static electricity. Even if the reactor blew Chernobyl-style, this plant has a pretty comprehensive containment system to keep all the mess in one spot.
The only thing that concerns me about those reports is that they've detected cesium downwind. That indicates that the fuel cladding has been compromised and uranium oxide fuel has mixed with the coolant water, evaporated to steam, and in some small quantity been released beyond the containment facility. How much has been released is impossible to know right now from media reports, but any release is not good at this point, and indicates that they've already got at least a partial meltdown underway. As long as they aren't dumb enough to let the byproduct hydrogen build up, and as long as they stop venting radionuclides to the atmosphere, a meltdown still just means a protracted and expensive cleanup with long-term loss of power generation (TMI-2 experienced the same thing in PA in 1979 and has never been put back in service). If they screw around with the hydrogen, though, and if they don't find a way to stop letting cesium out, this could get ugly. By now they should be well past the point of unforeseen cascading casualties, and out to have time to get a plan into place instead of just reacting to the moment without thought of the eventualities.
Great news:
Radiation leaks from quake-hit nuke plant - World news - Asia-Pacific - msnbc.com
IWAKI, Japan — An explosion at a nuclear power station Saturday destroyed a building housing the reactor, but a radiation leak was decreasing despite fears of a meltdown from damage caused by a powerful earthquake and tsunami, officials said.
Government spokesman Yukio Edano said the explosion destroyed the exterior walls of the building where the reactor is placed, but not the actual metal housing enveloping the reactor. That was welcome news for a country suffering from Friday's double disaster that pulverized the northeastern coast, leaving at least 574 people dead by official count.
The blast at the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear facility occurred just hours after officials said they feared the reactor could melt down. The area was later also hit by a 6.4-magnitude aftershock.
Footage on Japanese TV showed the explosion had crumbled the building's walls, leaving only a skeletal metal frame standing. Its roof had also been blown off. Plumes of smoke spewed out of the plant, 20 miles from Iwaki.
Radiation leaks from quake-hit nuke plant - World news - Asia-Pacific - msnbc.com
IWAKI, Japan — An explosion at a nuclear power station Saturday destroyed a building housing the reactor, but a radiation leak was decreasing despite fears of a meltdown from damage caused by a powerful earthquake and tsunami, officials said.
Government spokesman Yukio Edano said the explosion destroyed the exterior walls of the building where the reactor is placed, but not the actual metal housing enveloping the reactor. That was welcome news for a country suffering from Friday's double disaster that pulverized the northeastern coast, leaving at least 574 people dead by official count.
The blast at the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear facility occurred just hours after officials said they feared the reactor could melt down. The area was later also hit by a 6.4-magnitude aftershock.
Footage on Japanese TV showed the explosion had crumbled the building's walls, leaving only a skeletal metal frame standing. Its roof had also been blown off. Plumes of smoke spewed out of the plant, 20 miles from Iwaki.
This is completely Crazy and Holy Shit
But any of you would like to help japan by donating any amount, please follow this link: Donate for Japan: Important links and information - Yahoo!7
Lets hope it shouldn't be disaster for US or any other country
But any of you would like to help japan by donating any amount, please follow this link: Donate for Japan: Important links and information - Yahoo!7
Lets hope it shouldn't be disaster for US or any other country
think about it the Japs didn't decide to print a trillion dollars in YEN. The yanks did. To top it off the Aussie dollar is over parity with the US. until the last couple of years that has never happened. The states is fucked... before you know it the indian ruppee will be parity with the US dollar..
I think the lesson was learned with Chernobyl, and you won't see cleanup going on like this:
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbCcutzXzYg"]YouTube - The Chernobyl disaster - the severe days[/ame]
Gotta love the leisurely cleanup. Next day I think most of the cleanup people were dead, with their organs turned into liquid goo.
While the media is really over-hyping things, improper handling of a meltdown can result in some real nastiness.
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbCcutzXzYg"]YouTube - The Chernobyl disaster - the severe days[/ame]
Gotta love the leisurely cleanup. Next day I think most of the cleanup people were dead, with their organs turned into liquid goo.
While the media is really over-hyping things, improper handling of a meltdown can result in some real nastiness.
Interesting and informative, thank you - this seems like a sensible analysis unclouded by politics. Please keep us posted with your friend's thoughts.
Apparently the plant that has sprung the leak after the explosion yesterday was due to be decomissioned later this month. Apparently there is legislation that says the plants are to run only for 4 years and the areas where these plants are located the jap government issues subsidies for their use and development....
BBC News - Struggle to stabilise Japan's Fukushima nuclear plant
There are actually 6 reactors at the plant with the most serious problems, Fukushima 1, 3 of which have issues, 2 of which are serious; reactor 1 in the building the blew up with a second explosion possible in the building housing reactor number 2 . The first explosion happened in the concrete building that houses the reactor containment vessel.
There's another plant to the south, Fukushima 2, with 4 reactors that has a possible radiation leak as far as I understand things (it's hard to keep track of it all).
Just for anyone that is interested: Go to this blog that has the The American Nuclear Society has an ongoing blog relaying updates on the situation at the Japanese nuclear plants. Apparently, all the sites other than Fukushima are going to be OK, and units 1,2, and 4 at Fukushima are safe now, so the difficulties are limited to unit 3.
Media updates on nuclear power stations in Japan | ANS Nuclear Cafe
That link should allow access to updates written by professionals instead of journalists looking to advance their careers through inducing panic.
About an hour ago there was a second tsunami about 10 feet high approaching Japan but that warning has now been canceled since the wave vanished.
Media updates on nuclear power stations in Japan | ANS Nuclear Cafe
That link should allow access to updates written by professionals instead of journalists looking to advance their careers through inducing panic.
About an hour ago there was a second tsunami about 10 feet high approaching Japan but that warning has now been canceled since the wave vanished.
Japan is a prepared country talking about erathquakes but this shit is insane, I mean how often do you see something like this
Tsunami alerts has been triggered all along American continent, from USA to Chile, crazy and scary shit
The video of the tsunami is insane
Next news article will be: WHY YOUR WAVES ARE VANISHING - WHAT YOU CAN DO TO BE PREPARED!~
Seriously sad news - I was trying to watch a little just to see what was up at the moment. Scary stuff there - but the way it's being reported is scarier.
At least they provided some details on where to donate so people wanting to help aren't getting scammed.
The earthquake has now been upgraded to 9.0
Unbelievable...
Anyone that has kids can feel the heartbreak in this picture.
I watched them interview a mother, that talked about being pulled under the wave in her house, trying to hold on to her daughter. The power of the wave, ripped the child out of her hands and she does not know what happened to her. Chilling...
Here is some more info:
BlogPost - Japan earthquake and tsunami: Live updates day three
Unbelievable...
Anyone that has kids can feel the heartbreak in this picture.
I watched them interview a mother, that talked about being pulled under the wave in her house, trying to hold on to her daughter. The power of the wave, ripped the child out of her hands and she does not know what happened to her. Chilling...
Here is some more info:
BlogPost - Japan earthquake and tsunami: Live updates day three
