Gold Standard in Gold Storage just told all US customers to Fuck off

[rusvik]

You can buy gold on every street corner in Thailand and only a few bucks in commission. One of the advantages of living in a poverty country.

I don't care about Chile, it seems like a very boring and probably cold country.

 

[lukep]

I think it's better to just pay taxes bro

No contest. I'll certainly be looking deeper into the subject when I have the time.

Why are conspiracy people all so obsessed with gold?

Perhaps because it's been THE defacto form of global money for 5000+ years?

You've only been conditioned to believe that those worthless pieces of paper in your wallet are money. They aren't backed by anything though, except debt, so they should be in fact worth negative money, not money.

Meanwhile, gold backs itself. It has other uses that man enjoys, like jewelry and electronics. It'll be worth something long after the last paper bill turns to dust.

You can buy gold on every street corner in Thailand and only a few bucks in commission. One of the advantages of living in a poverty country.

DEM PANDAS, Amirite? -Love that about this place... But I wouldn't call it "a poverty country."

I don't care about Chile, it seems like a very boring and probably cold country.

Chile is almost as tall as China is long... It stretches from the world's driest desert in the north, near the Amazon, all the way down to (almost) Antartica, and therefore has every climate zone within it... The climate near Santiago is very much like southern California or the Med. Not very cold at all.

 

[Andrew Scherer]

I'll be visiting for the first time later this year, but there's little hurry since I'm pretty safe here in BKK too.

Gotta hand it to you Luke. For all the people that talked shit about you last year not thinking you'd pack your bags, and here you are an original globe trotting expat. Where's the haters at now?

P.S. Your Chile top 10 is great but it's missing the biggest thing that affects gay webmasters directly. Their burgeoning IT sector and also Chile itself offering incentives for high-tech startups. Looks like they're looking to be latin america's silicon valley, pretty cool.

 

[cassius]

Do I really have to tell you the difference? Plz go uze teh googlez and edumacate urself.

Tell me the difference. My family has gold with Brink's and JPM in Singapore. What's the functional difference for me?

 

[pixelo]

Perhaps because it's been THE defacto form of global money for 5000+ years?

You've only been conditioned to believe that those worthless pieces of paper in your wallet are money. They aren't backed by anything though, except debt, so they should be in fact worth negative money, not money.

Meanwhile, gold backs itself. It has other uses that man enjoys, like jewelry and electronics. It'll be worth something long after the last paper bill turns to dust.
.

Hmmm seems like a bit of an armageddon fantasy to me. Money has been the defacto form of global money for quite a long time no?

Also spears and swords were the defacto form of weaponry for several thousand years each too.

If "the man" and his tricksy paper money all disappears in a cloud of whatever disaster you think is coming, why would everyone suddenly default to gold? Its current value isn't purely based on its usefulness for electronics and jewellery.

 

[Unarmed Gunman]

Hmmm seems like a bit of an armageddon fantasy to me. Money has been the defacto form of global money for quite a long time no?

Also spears and swords were the defacto form of weaponry for several thousand years each too.

If "the man" and his tricksy paper money all disappears in a cloud of whatever disaster you think is coming, why would everyone suddenly default to gold? Its current value isn't purely based on its usefulness for electronics and jewellery.

You wouldn't happen to be on a kosher diet, would you?

 

[lukep]

Tell me the difference. My family has gold with Brink's and JPM in Singapore. What's the functional difference for me?

Well, Brinks is an american corp, based out of Virginia. (Not far from the Pentagon, in fact.) JPM needs no explanation I'd hope, seeing that they are clearly one of the banks who benefited the most during the financial meltdown recently. So not only are they likely to be in control or influencing all of this bad policy that might lead to your gold being confiscated, they are an american company too.

Why does it make a difference if they are american? -Because uncle sam has far more influence over them and KNOWS what you have stored with them... Surely I don't have to remind you what happend to people in your situation last time uncle sam got greedy for gold:

By keeping it in american banks, you'll never even be notified first... They'll just turn it all over and let you know later if they feel like paying you some kind of market rate for it.

Hmmm seems like a bit of an armageddon fantasy to me. Money has been the defacto form of global money for quite a long time no?

LOLOLOL! Where do you people come up with this stuff??

Thanks for the laugh... But in case you were serious; Each individual money had a pretty shitty end-of-life... The USD won't be any different.

 

[pixelo]

LOLOLOL! Where do you people come up with this stuff??

Thanks for the laugh... But in case you were serious; Each individual money had a pretty shitty end-of-life... The USD won't be any different.

I dunno, money seems to be a more universally adopted form of trading currently than Gold.

Gold is just another commodity, I was just curious as to why so many "alternative" people are really into gold as the Armageddon stock pile currency of choice.

 

[dmnEPC]

I dunno, money seems to be a more universally adopted form of trading currently than Gold.

Gold is just another commodity, I was just curious as to why so many "alternative" people are really into gold as the Armageddon stock pile currency of choice.

And Russia’s gold hoarding appears to have accelerated last year. According to one recent report, Russia added 3.2 million ounces of gold to their reserves in 2012 alone.
But of even greater concern is China. Nobody really knows how much gold China has, because they do not tell us, but all indications point to the fact that Chinese gold hoarding has gone into overdrive. The following is from a Zero Hedge article from a few months ago…
Because while earlier today we were wondering (rhetorically, of course) what China is doing with all that excess trade surplus if it is not recycling it back into Treasurys, now we once again find out that instead of purchasing US paper, Beijing continues to buy non-US gold, in the form of 68 tons in imports from Hong Kong in the month of June. The year to date total (6 months)? 383 tons. In other words, in half a year China, whose official total tally is still a massively underrepresented 1054 tons, has imported more gold than the official gold reserves of Portugal, Venezuela, Saudi Arabia, the UK, and so on, and whose YTD imports alone make it the 14th largest holder of gold in the world. Realistically, by now China, which hasn’t provided an honest gold reserve holdings update to the IMF in years, most certainly has more gold than the IMF, and its 2814 tons, itself. Of course, the moment the PBOC does announce its official updated gold stash, a gold price in the mid-$1000 range will be a long gone memory.

I guess its just alternative people into gold

 

[d_diggler]

I dunno, money seems to be a more universally adopted form of trading currently than Gold.

Gold is just another commodity, I was just curious as to why so many "alternative" people are really into gold as the Armageddon stock pile currency of choice.

Money is and always has been no more than a promissory note for value.

In itself it holds no value, e.g. the paper it's printed on isn't worth anything. Before fiat money and fractional reserve banking the note used to be guaranteed by Gold - e.g. somewhere there was gold to the value of that note and you could take the note and request the gold.

Gold's been the standard measure of value for thousands of years, it's fairly easy to carry, divisible, stable as in it doesn't breakdown and it's scarce enough to hold a reasonably stable value based on new supply.

It is just a commodity and not an overly useful one so the value does and will always fluctuate, but it seems a fairly good bet as a means to hold value based on history. I doubt there will be a day when Gold suddenly becomes worthless although some crazy USSR guys did manage to produce some in a nuclear reactor, when the radioactivity wears off in a few million years and this comes online maybe things will change.

The point I'm trying to make though is that it isn't only crackpots who see gold as a safe way to hold their wealth, it is and always has been a go to safe bet for mainstream investment and many 'safe' funds and fund managers will have holdings in precious metals.

You should still diversify but while you can hide gold reasonably easily, you're going to struggle to hide a big bit of land or obtain any value from a defunct share certificate or Government bond.

 

[mattseh]

Luke, you have done well in this thread, srsly, haters gonna hate. I may be back in BKK in a few weeks

 

[lukep]

I dunno, money seems to be a more universally adopted form of trading currently than Gold.

If you only care about liquidity, then fine; US FRNs are the way to go... Today... They just lose value like a rowboat that someone's shot a hole in the bottom of given any scale of time. -Just remember that there are many different criteria that people use to judge money's "worth." Such as how well it keeps over time, how many other civilizations will see it as worthy, and of course how it isn't tied to a particular government, which might not be there tomorrow... Fungability and Malleability are also historically important. Taken together there are tons of different reasons people will prefer one form of money over another; so it's not just for conspiracy-minded folk to seek out other currencies.

Gold is just another commodity, I was just curious as to why so many "alternative" people are really into gold as the Armageddon stock pile currency of choice.

Well now you have your answer: Because we have no trust in the FRN. (Nor the Euro, nor the pound, nor the yen, etc...) The issue has always been about trust.

Luke, you have done well in this thread, srsly, haters gonna hate. I may be back in BKK in a few weeks

Cool, gimmie more notice next time and we'll grab lunch or something.

 

[Lexicon]

1. Plenty, such as when, where, and how to prevent it. If a comet was coming would we all just ignore the subject until it hit us?

2. Some folks around here don't seem to understand, or believe at all, that things really are bad now. They just plod along thinking "it's always been kinda bad but not too bad... this is just more of the same."

Sadly they're wrong this time, there are many huge indicators, and this isn't even one of the biggest ones... So I guess there is always the wake up call to talk about, which I seem to be the only one with any passion for around here.



Actually no, Singapore and HK are both very free comparred to the US but their downsides are Huge.

Chile, however, is even more free than those two countries, and it's downsides are extremely small.

This is a subject Simon Black covers in extreme detail. After he started building the first Libertarian community down there several years ago, there have already been others following suit.

To paraphrase Simon, the benefits of Chile are:

1. It's Economically sound with a small government.
2. It's economy is booming.
3. Taxes are very low and their tax code is short and sane.
4. The gov there allows for very strong property rights.
5. There is very minimal corruption, no bribery in sight.
6. Starting a legal business there takes a few minutes, even for americans!
7. It's well developed & modern. Really. Looks like LA in the bigger cities.
8. People are civilized & stable, with an independent mindset.
9. Pick your ideal climate; Chile's got it.
10. It's frigging gorgeous there, with the Andes's tallest peaks only 2 hours away from some of the best beaches on the planet. (And great cities like Santiago right inbetween.)

Santiago:

I'll be visiting for the first time later this year, but there's little hurry since I'm pretty safe here in BKK too.



Chances of this happening: 0.00%.

Move along now; time to find something that IS possible.



There seem to be many different ways to buy into gold, and yeah, certificates for it sound by far the most stupid to me too. Owning stock in mining companies is the runner up in my mind for stupidity, since it's still vulnerable to stock market fuckups.

However not everyone has a well-fortified cabin in the woods like you bro; holding onto physical gold is kinda scary for ppl who live in apartments (like me) and for wussies who wouldn't own a gun. (Like eurofags.)

Then of course keeping it in a safe deposit box at a bank is a popular choice, but of course the government can and does already confiscate those, wiping out a lifetime of wealth building... So clearly that sucks, unless you can get the bank out of a government's jurisdiction.

That's where ViaMat came in. They are global with banks in tons of different countries... No one government could steal your wealth from them... But today we found out that one country CAN force them to drop their citizens... So it's still not a perfect solution for americans.

Your best bet? Move to Chile, Singapore, HK, or Thailand and become a resident. (There may be other countries, like Nicaragua, Uraguay & some Caribbean islands, but those four are big & sound.) Get your money far away from the clutches of the evil empire.

May I suggest St vincent?

 

[sennin436]

I dunno, money seems to be a more universally adopted form of trading currently than Gold.

Gold is just another commodity, I was just curious as to why so many "alternative" people are really into gold as the Armageddon stock pile currency of choice.

Perhaps you're confusing "convenience" over "value"? I think Luke sort of mentioned it when he said 'liquidity'. Sure, you can't currently go into a local grocery store, car dealership, etc, etc, with gold coins to buy stuff. They'll most likely refuse them. Even in an 'armageddon situation' I'm thinking "Hmmm....most retail stores and/or average individuals probably won't carry around the necessary tools to analyze your gold coins, whether they're real or fake or to immediately know what kind of value to place on them, etc." So ya, it's not nearly as liquid or convenient as a medium of exchange like we enjoy right now with paper money. But still.... there's always that 'what if' scenario where your paper can become worthless (ex: hyperinflation, etc).

Which leaves me with some noob questions....erm...what is the likely scenario when we wanna buy or exchange things with gold in the future? Currently (in a non-armageddon scenario) it seems like the only option is to go to a coin dealer and exchange it for cash....And in an armageddon-like scenario?

 

[Spitsofar]

Honestly, I don't understand the gold thing much. If the economy collapses to the degree you guys are talking, gold nuggets / bars are going to be pretty worthless too. People will be trading in things like food, ammo, gas, etc. If you walk up to a rancher, and try to buy one of this cows with a gold nugget, he's probably going to either laugh at you or shoot you.

If the economy collapses Gold will be worth a lot and paper will be worth even less, it would probably cause a further rush into Gold.

PS: Economy will NOT collapse what do you think money printing is there for, to keep it going until some way shit hits the fan.

 

[ayzo]

Quick question for those of you bullish on gold, a lot of bulls point to China which has been the biggest buyer of gold for a while but doesn't it worry you that there is an increasing amount of speculation that China has a massive real estate/credit/debt/bond bubble thats ready to pop?

China Looks Like a Bubble Economy, GMO Says - Emerging Markets Daily - Barrons.com

China’s cheap, it’s underperformed other emerging markets and its economy has the wind at its back. What’s not to like?

How about its bubble economy? That’s what keeps GMO’s Edward Chancellor and Mike Monnelly underweight–and up at night, according to a new report.

Take China’s rapid credit growth. In 2009, non-financial credit expanded by the equivalent of 45% of the nations 2008 GDP–and has needed an increasing amount of credit to keep growing. From 2007 to 2012, the ratio of credit to GDP has increased to 190%. That’s faster than the credit booms of Japan in the 1980s or the U.S. during before the financial crisis. And the speed of growth, rather then the actual amount is often more problematic.

Other stats are equally astonishing. “Last year, Chinese banks’ share of total lending fell to only 52% of total credit creation, down from 92% a decade ago,” Chancellor and Monnelly write. “In the fourth quarter of 2012, nonbank lending accounted for an astonishing 60% of new credit issuance.” The comparison to the U.S. before Lehman Brothers’ collapse is apt, they argue.

Chancellor and Monnelly provide a handy list of credit-related worries:

• Excessive credit growth (combined with an epic real estate boom)
• Moral hazard (i.e., the very widespread belief that Beijing has underwritten all bank risk)
• Related-party lending (to local government infrastructure projects)
• Loan forbearance (aka “evergreening” of local government loans)
• De facto financial liberalization (which has accompanied the growth of the shadow banking system)
• Ponzi finance (i.e., the need for rising asset prices to validate wealth management products and trust loans)
• An increase in bank off-balance-sheet exposures (masking a rise in leverage)
• Duration mismatches and roll-over risk (owing to short wealth management product maturities)
• Contagion risk (posed by credit guarantee networks)
• Widespread financial fraud and corruption (from fake valuations on collateral to mis-selling of financial products)

There are tons of other people echoing these same concerns, a quick search on zerohedge for "china" turns up more negative indicators. Also the way China measures GDP on the supply side based on how much stuff they build (hello ghost cities) rather than on the demand side is kind of sketchy. If China does pop and they are forced liquidate huge amounts of gold don't you think that will drive gold down or do you think there is enough global demand outside of China and the countries that are dependent on exporting to China that prices would remain stable?

 

[dmnEPC]

Which leaves me with some noob questions....erm...what is the likely scenario when we wanna buy or exchange things with gold in the future? Currently (in a non-armageddon scenario) it seems like the only option is to go to a coin dealer and exchange it for cash....And in an armageddon-like scenario?

You might be surprised to know that people are already trading goods for silver and gold. It doesn't happen often (actually pretty rare) and is anything but normal, but it does happen. I have recently been offered silver as part of a sales transaction. Your not going to find your local wally world taking metals.

When you support small local business's you just might be surprised what the owner tells you when you offer him metal for his goods and services.

 

[Scalped]

Its a point of transition - simple as that - conspiracy or no conspiracy fiat money is not the way to go and it wont last.

Trade reverts to goal/precious metals for the simple fact that it IS an asset based on true limited world resources. Currency is just fiction.

Money as we know it will probably dissapear and in future it will likely be electronic currency - just look at all the tech coming out for ease of e-payment.

Then go and try hide your precious gains from the taxman lol.

Lukep is right.

 

[Andrey]

Honestly, I don't understand the gold thing much. If the economy collapses to the degree you guys are talking, gold nuggets / bars are going to be pretty worthless too. People will be trading in things like food, ammo, gas, etc. If you walk up to a rancher, and try to buy one of this cows with a gold nugget, he's probably going to either laugh at you or shoot you.

It is true. However, I think gold of a storage of value and is to be used when things start stabilizing. Also only so much food, ammo, gas you can buy.

 

[droplister]

I wish I bought gold in high school when it was at $600 an ounce, but at that point in time, for me personally, it was just better to make more websites. I didn't really have wealth to protect anyways.

I could have probably afforded to buy about $8k worth of gold, but if I had, 6 years later it would only be worth somewhere around $20k. That's not an investment return, but as a protection of wealth. Sure.

Side note: it was stupid obvious then, even for a kid like me in high school, that the price of gold was set to go sky rocket and if you're just on that tip right now, wow. This isn't some hindsight wisdom, I was running a website called spotprice.org back then.

Today, I'd still rather make websites, but I'm probably going to acquire some gold in this form (image found from ebay link in this thread):

Gold coins are cool, but in an oh shit situation, I want small bits of gold that I can use not one big coin.

Interesting though, watch this video. For these people, what is more valuable the bread or the gold? If you only have gold and nothing that satisfy needs, you'll be like these poor miners. Giving up gold for bread. Instead of getting people's gold for food stuffs.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3LdNxV0yPM]Zimbabwe - gold for bread - YouTube[/ame]

My friend has been buying a lot of silver. He goes to coin shops and buys old coins that have two values: their weight in silver, but also their face value.