How long would you live in Thailand for?

I think most of you guys are doing it wrong.

Thailand is not a place to go where everything is fair, proper and neatly wrapped for your convenience. It's a 3rd world country and you should expect that going in.
So you're going to pay an extra 100 baht more than a local? Who gives a fuck. Stop being a peasant. I know that they are ripping me off but I only give enough of a fuck to stop the blatant stupidity. Anymore then that is just not worth my time. I haggle once, maybe twice if it's big. Anything else then that I just go with it. 50 baht is not worth 10 seconds of my precious time to spend talking to a greedy Thai fucktard in BKK.

Want the good life IMO? Go live on an island. An island inhabited mostly by westerners (koh tao). It's not as cheap as a shit-hole city but you have a much more western way of life (that I like), and usually the locals are much more genuinely friendly because they live a good care free life.
 


1. Learn Muay Thai in Thailand for 2-3 years
2. Visit Burma and challenge locals to a Lethwei bare knuckle boxing match.
3. Profit?

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZrWwoeRTXOc]Thai vs myanmar 2011 fight 3 - YouTube[/ame]
 
^ Brutal! No doubt these guys have heart. Also, why I would never, ever get in a fight with a Thai.
 
Ummm, I don't really notice it too much to be honest. I never goto the villages anymore though, as they piss me off. Mothers dragging their kids over to gawk at the white guy, everyone gathers around hoping for a free party on your bill, all the while talking shit about you right in front of you, because they think you don't understand, have no shortage of sob stories, ask for your help but are totally disrespectful when you provide it, they have absolutely no decision making capability whatsoever, etc. Fuck 'em. Just keep the rice and chicken coming, as that's all they're good for.

That's not just village behavior. That's Bangkok behavior. And it's not just the poor people. Let's see . . . I was sitting in a Burger King waiting for some "certified" translations I needed at the US embassy when a 5 year old Thai starts yelling "Farang! Farang! Farang!" pointing at me. His mother was an obviously upper-middle class lady and turned beet red.

But the thing that bothers me is if you know Thai culture you know how rude that just was. I think that's another part of why the culture-shock works in reverse. Once you learn all of the little ins-and-outs of Thai culture you realize they often act very rude and disrespectfully towards us thinking we won't get it.

The mother mouthed, "Sorry" to me and I do believe she was genuinely embarrassed but not because her child had been rude to me, per se, but because his creating a scene had caused her to lose face. The racism of the situation probably never occurred to her.

But yeah, there are lots of lazy cunts with a victim mentality around, and I'm not sure why. I'm guessing Thaksin and the red-shirts instilled an entitlement mindset into everyone up here? (btw... Americans, you think Obama is good at that? He has nothing on Thaksin). You do have to learn how to be firm (with a smile of course), but once you learn the ropes, and learn how to conduct yourself (again, with a smile), then it's fine, and you'll never have any issues whatsoever. Or at least I don't. Then again, doesn't hurt to have a few Thais who'll watch your back for you too. From my experience, lots of Thais will gladly up their price by 20%+ (eg. electrician, food stall, whatever) for a foreigner, but will never spite another Thai in doing it.

It has nothing to do with Thaksin. Thaksin is like a black/grey hat SEO. And the ultra-rich and ultra-powerful (and the people that can't be spoken about) are Google or white hats. The Elite set up a system with poor educational opportunities and a patronage style governance (which is very common in Asia in general) so that the people had little upward mobility and prospered only by showing extreme loyalty to those above them who rewarded their loyalty with hand outs.

Thaksin simply tapped into that and harnessed the pent up anger. He paid farmers more than the other guys would for their votes. He promised crazy-stupid schemes (like the current rice scheme his sister rode to the PM spot on) that were going to make everyone rich.

But my all time favorite Thaksin family stunt is when things like the flooding happen, when the US and the rest of the world start dumping relief supplies in, they get their hands on them, repackage them or slap a sticker on them, saying that these are a personal gift from Thaksin.

All depends who you surround yourself with. There's loads of great, hard working people around, who really don't give a flying fuck about how much you make, and will never ask you for anything. For example, take my neighborhood. By no means rich, but everyone has a nice house, couple vehicles, many are putting a kid or two through uni, going on vacations, one lady just went to the UK, another guy is heading to New York shortly, etc. And these aren't rich Thais. Just typical middle class.

That's nice, in theory. However, I know sooo many people who have been ripped off by people who they've known for years. For instance, about a year ago, one of my good friends living in BKK was flying back to the US on vacation with his family and when he arrived in Chicago for a layover he was told that he had to pay for the rest of his ticket. He only had a reservation on his connection flight. No confirmed seat.

On the way back, none of his flight was paid for. He called his agent that had booked the trip for him back in BKK and she told him it was all a big mistake. She told him to just pay it and they would get a refund for him when he got back.

He had no reason not to trust her. He had been booking all of his travel with her for 7 years. He had referred millions of baht in business to her.

And not just business. She had been invited over to his home for holiday parties and such. She had come over and given a gift to his child when she was first born. This was someone you could consider a family friend at this point.

But when he got back, the business was closed, and she had taken off for the villages to hide out from her customers.

Fortunately, my friend speaks Thai almost fluently and he remembered her talking about her village in the past so he was able to track her down. She started giving him some BS excuses and such but he wasn't having any of it.

He finally had to out her publicly on Facebook (in Thai) and in other forums (in Thai) and threatened to have the police come get her. She finally agreed to a payment plan to pay him back.

Or another friend who had a business emergency in Singapore and asked a Thai friend he had known for 10 years to look after his condo while he was away. He offered her a few thousand baht per month for her troubles.

When he returned, she sold everything of value from his apartment and had then disappeared up into Issan.

It's not that people rip you off in Thailand. It's that no matter how long you've known them, how much you've helped them, or how close you've been with them and their family, if you leave your guard down, many of them will strip you like a car in a bad neighborhood.

If you want to meet good people, don't hang out in the farang ghettos, or with poverty stricken peasants, that's all. There's a small farang ghetto here with some girlie bars, but you'll never see myself or anyone worth befriending there. That's why it can be hard to find decent expat friends, because you'll never see us in the expat areas. If we go for a few beers, it'll be at one of the local neighborhood drinking holes. If we go out for dinner, it'll be at a decent Thai restaurant, and definitely not an expat restaurant where you're charged triple for mediocre food and half-assed service. If we go for a night out, it's either a house party, or a larger Thai club with live music, but definitely not in the farang ghetto.

Whew, long enough... I could talk forever about this subject. :)

But because of the low English fluency rate, your chances of meeting the types of people you're talking about are slim and none for a n00b in Thailand. You go to places where they speak English so you end up at the same old farang ghetto places.

I think it takes a good year or two before you figure out the difference. Some never do.

That's why I literally LOL when I hear someone from Pattaya complaining about Thai people. You couldn't pick a worse farang ghetto. It's the worst of the expats mixed with the worst of the Thais. What a combination! :-)

Oh, and one comment about the racism thing. That goes both ways, eh guys? Just look at this thread for an example. If you talked about me like that, I'd think you're a total cunt too. And you guys are talking about the expat areas, where there's loads of tourists who show up, and treat Thais like sub-human pieces of meat that can be bought and sold, so how do you expect them to react?

I actually get into this debate with Thai friends (and my wife) all the time. Thais usually shoot back that all Thais aren't like that. Then I ask, "Did you complete high school?" They say, "Yes." Then I remind them that just based on percentages, they aren't the majority of Thais. Did you go to university? Oh, you did, so that puts you into about the upper 20% of Thais.


I can safely say I don't generally experience any racism whatsoever. Sure when I first moved here eyebrows were raised, but once we all got to know each other, it was fine. Same as if you're in a white community, and some immigrant from Jamaica moves in. Granted I'm not treated like a Thai, because well, I'm not Thai (and don't want to be), but I am treated like a very welcomed immigrant, which is the best I can hope for. I'm definitely not treated badly due to my white skin, that's for sure. If I was, I'd leave.

Hate to break it to you but all of the things you've said you've experienced like being gawked at, expected to let people party on your tab, raised eyebrows, dual pricing, etc is racism. They're treating you differently because of your race.

And the fact that you aren't treated like a Thai is racism too.
 
I do somewhat disagree with rusvik though about their political/economic situation though. It's not the westerners in Thailand that are propping up the place. It's the fact that they got a 40 year head start. They are the only country in the region western countries would do business with.


Now that's changing. Vietnam has kissed and made up with the west and is growing like wildfire. Cambodia is getting back on it's feet and starting to compete as well.

God knows which country you live in but you suck at geography and economics.

Thailand is the best country in south east asia to do business? Are you fucking kidding me?

Ever heard of a country called Singapore?

1) Singapore is the world's richest country with over $59000 Per capita income and will remain the richest till 2050 according to the recent economic survey.

2) Singapore is the world's most easiest country to do business. You can setup a company in less than 15 mins.

3) Singapore's sovereign fund is the world's largest ever owning stake in all major banking corporations, telecom and what not. Singapore pretty much owns all big corporations one way or another through Temasek holdings.

4) Singapore is also the cleanest country in the world.

5) Singapore has the highest percentage of millionaire household. Over 16% of population are millionaires and Over 2% billionaires.

6) Singapore has less than 2% crime rate. One of the best in the world

7) Singapore is also the healthiest country in the world.

8) Singapore has the world's busiest port. Over 60% of the market is dominated by singapore.

9) Singapore is also the least corrupted country in the world.

I can go on and on coz we are just badass.

I didn't want to list all of these but most retards think singapore is a part of china so have to explain in detail.

How many of you want to move to Singapore?

Do read more: Singapore - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
God knows which country you live in but you suck at geography and economics.

Thailand is the best country in south east asia to do business? Are you fucking kidding me?

Ever heard of a country called Singapore?

1) Singapore is the world's richest country with over $59000 Per capita income and will remain the richest till 2050 according to the recent economic survey.

2) Singapore is the world's most easiest country to do business. You can setup a company in less than 15 mins.

3) Singapore's sovereign fund is the world's largest ever owning stake in all major banking corporations, telecom and what not. Singapore pretty much owns all big corporations one way or another through Temasek holdings.

4) Singapore is also the cleanest country in the world.

5) Singapore has the highest percentage of millionaire household. Over 16% of population are millionaires and Over 2% billionaires.

6) Singapore has less than 2% crime rate. One of the best in the world

7) Singapore is also the healthiest country in the world.

8) Singapore has the world's busiest port. Over 60% of the market is dominated by singapore.

9) Singapore is also the least corrupted country in the world.

I can go on and on coz we are just badass.

I didn't want to list all of these but most retards think singapore is a part of china so have to explain in detail.

How many of you want to move to Singapore?

Do read more: Singapore - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Having been to Singapore, I know where it is. But I'm talking about the whole Golden Triangle region which Singapore is certainly not a part of.

Singapore does not have the land mass to produce rice, rubber, and other products on the scale that Thailand does. The US is Thailand's biggest trading partner and Europe (as a group) is second. Thailand has always had a strategic role in the area.

Also, because of the history of opium production in the region, Thailand was the only country in the region that would allow US DEA agents to operate.

And please check my quote again, I didn't say it was the best place to live. There is no best place to live. Best if a personal choice. I said that Thailand was the only country in that region that western countries would do business with.

And everything I did say (vs what you claim I said) can be verified by foreign investments in Thailand's neighboring countries. Right now, Vietnam is on fire. Especially since the floods in Thailand which dislocated many businesses. Now that they have the option of picking where to rebuild, many are choosing Vietnam and Cambodia over Thailand.

And many of the investment banks who specialize in the region say that Thailand is becoming a less and less attractive choice for investors looking to set up manufacturing bases in the area.

But to address your comments about Singapore . . .

I think one of the reasons people look to Thailand is because of the low cost of living. Singapore is, on average, about 25% - 35% more expensive than living in Bangkok. If you compare it to living out in the countryside or away from central Bangkok the gap is even wider.

In fact, Singapore is about, if not more, expensive than Los Angeles.

The thread was not about what country has the lowest crime rate or all of the other Wikipedia facts you pulled. It's about people who are looking for a specific type of lifestyle. And Singapore is the antithesis of that lifestyle since it is more expensive than most people's home countries.

There plenty of valid reasons for living and having a business in Singapore but low cost of living is not one of those reasons.
 
and to bust your bubble, Vietnam is no more on fire. It used to be on fire a few years back. I worked in investment banking for over 8 years before getting into this biz and still invest in emerging markets. I know over 4 large investment banks including Morgan Stanley have pulled out their offices and major workforce from vietnam due to the lack of momentum.

Dr. Ngo, you obviously have chosen the wrong woman and i believe you would rather prefer a woman over a thai ladyboy. am i right?

However, I do agree that cost of living is way high here and i think there are several reasons why its high as I stated above.

If you want to live in a 3rd world shithole with $300 rent, you are more than welcome to live in thailand. If you want a classy living, come here.
 
Unless you have actual business ties to Singapore (ie. daily / weekly meetings you need to attend), why on earth would you live there? Granted it's a really nice place and all, but you're paying about an extra $4k/month for the same standard of living as others have, if not a lower standard of living.

Probably costs around $8k/month just to have a simple life in a 1 bdrm condo there.
 
and to bust your bubble, Vietnam is no more on fire. It used to be on fire a few years back. I worked in investment banking for over 8 years before getting into this biz and still invest in emerging markets. I know over 4 large investment banks including Morgan Stanley have pulled out their offices and major workforce from vietnam due to the lack of momentum.

Dr. Ngo, you obviously have chosen the wrong woman and i believe you would rather prefer a woman over a thai ladyboy. am i right?

However, I do agree that cost of living is way high here and i think there are several reasons why its high as I stated above.

If you want to live in a 3rd world shithole with $300 rent, you are more than welcome to live in thailand. If you want a classy living, come here.

Well, that was sort of the point. The OP was asking for advice on relocating to Thailand. If he had asked for advice on where the best places to stay in Asia, regardless of cost, Singapore would have been on the list.
 
I stayed there for just one month. Liked it a lot. But I guess I have not lived there long enough to give a recommendation about a long stay... One of my friend have been living there for about 3-4 years now and likes it too...
 
Unless you have actual business ties to Singapore (ie. daily / weekly meetings you need to attend), why on earth would you live there? Granted it's a really nice place and all, but you're paying about an extra $4k/month for the same standard of living as others have, if not a lower standard of living.

Probably costs around $8k/month just to have a simple life in a 1 bdrm condo there.

Exactly what I said, yes its expensive. I pay high 4x for my condo. Its a standard of living that i was talking about. You can't compare singapore to thailand. Without a doubt, you won't get the standard in thailand no matter where you live. I like living in the city which is calm, quiet and clean and most importantly prosperous. I like to stay at a safer place. If you just want to save money, why not move to afghanistan, rwanda, mongolia, you can prolly live like a king.

There are several reasons why chinese millionaires/billionaires who made their millions in china are moving to Singapore than living in beijing. Why don't they stay back in china? The answer is simple, the standard of living is way high in singapore.

Also I probably missed this part earlier, If you are earning anything less than $10K a month do not even bother moving to Singapore, you are better off in thailand.

That said, I know most of you guys won't come and settle here and would rather waste time to save money in thailand and eventually get bored. I will just let you guys arrive at that conclusion the hard way :-)
 
That is unfortunately not the whole truth.

If you understand how things work in China, you will know that Singapore is a backup plan for many of the people who have made millions. Singapore is indeed "safe" but they're thinking in terms of not having their assets seized or getting thrown in jail. A good percentage of those who achieve success in China had to use some "unsavory" method or other at one point.

A look at the recent Bo Xilai's case is a good example of this. Where did his wealth truly come from? Shanghai is just as great and safe a destination for the single expat. In fact, it probably delivers more for the same amount of money. But it's not a beach paradise.


There are several reasons why chinese millionaires/billionaires who made their millions in china are moving to Singapore than living in beijing. Why don't they stay back in china? The answer is simple, the standard of living is way high in singapore.
 
I think Thailand works in reverse. For the first 6 - 12 months it's like an adult Disneyland. After the high wears off you start to see things for what they are.

One of the things that makes Thailand very different for western people going there is that the culture is so radically different than we're used to. So, in the beginning you tend to just accept that this or that is the way they do things.

Part of it is because in Thailand, everything is very shallow. Everything in Thailand is done for appearance. They call it "gaining face."

So, everything has a public facade which is meant to be charming, beautiful, and pleasant. But only after you've been there awhile do you see the cracks and you peel back the facade and see what's behind.

For instance, a very common saying in Thailand amongst expats is, "Behind the Thai smile are some very sharp fangs."

Thais smile constantly. That leads many people to believe that they're happy or that they're pleasant to be around. But that sweet smiling person could be plotting to rip you off or may loathe your very existence on this planet.

Or you see these beautiful buildings with every modern fixture and convenience and two years later the building is falling apart because the developers used shoddy materials.

But for the first 6 -12 months you don't see any of that. You haven't had someone who you thought was a friend rip you off yet. You haven't purchased something and had it fall apart yet. During your break-in period, you only see the facade.

I was going to Thailand 2 or 3 times a year for nearly 7 years before I moved there and I thought I knew Thailand and Thai culture. But it wasn't until I moved there that it really hit me in the face. Fortunately, because I was already pretty familiar with Thai culture, my learning curve was flattened significantly but I still found myself shaking my head at times.

Thus why I recommend Thailand as a vacation destination but caution people not to move there until they really, really, really understand Thai culture.

that's a damned good post. thank you.
 
Its a standard of living that i was talking about. You can't compare singapore to thailand. Without a doubt, you won't get the standard in thailand no matter where you live.

I don't know, all depends on how you view it. In Singapore it's probably $3k/month for a small 1bdrm condo, whereas here for $3k you can get a 6bdrm mansion with a huge yard, private swimming pool, and separate maid's house out back.

Singapore is definitely a beautiful place, no question. Nonetheless, unless I have financial interests there (eg. business partners), then I don't care how clean the streets are, I'm not spending $10k/month to live a standard life in a small condo.

Don't get me wrong, not bashing Singapore or your decision to live there. It's definitely a beautiful city, and the few times I was there the people seemed great. Each to their own. :)
 
But...but...

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whoaaaaa!!!!!!!!!! that looks promising