Nelson Rohihlahla Mandela,

[casteyn]

As one of the Proud South Africans on Wicked Fire, I thought I would write a few of my thoughts on Nelson Mandela and South Africa from a normal everyday guys perspective.
Who was Nelson Mandela to me? He was a leader that inspired greatness, he was our first Black president, He was the only president in the history of our country that never had a single mention of being corrupt or involvement in any bribery, corruption or any other negative publicity. He was a man of complete integrity. People that met him in person were always amazed that he was so genuinely interested in them and their lives. He had the most incredible sense of humour and would make his presence of greatness felt in any room or place he entered. The humility, the forgiveness and compassion he showed to those that persecuted him, is otherworldly, there is not many words that can describe that. It will more than likely take a century or more for another Human being to be as great as this man. There was just on 90 Heads of state at his Memorial which is the largest gathering ever of so many Heads of State in one place at any given Time Ever!! I am truly blessed to live in this country and being abled to call this home. As Barrack Obama said in his speech, Many world leaders should take an introspective look at themselves and take some lessons from Nelson Rohihlahla Mandela. – Let your Legacy live on Forever.

 

[mattseh]

Do you think his organisation's killing of civilians was justified?

 

[casteyn]

Killing another person is never justifiable. He never ordered or was ever linked to any killings. There was extremists in the organisation as in any.

 

[VonRohn]

Killing another person is never justifiable. He never ordered or was ever linked to any killings. There was extremists in the organisation as in any.

So he was the leader of ANC and of Umkhonto we Sizwe (created for violence as by Mandela's own words) when they commited multiple bombings, murders (including by necklacing - publicly endorsed by his then wife) and massacres. Are we supposed to believe that all that happened without Mandela's consent?

 

[quintana]

So he was the leader of ANC and of Umkhonto we Sizwe (created for violence as by Mandela's own words) when they commited multiple bombings, murders (including by necklacing - publicly endorsed by his then wife) and massacres. Are we supposed to believe that all that happened without Mandela's consent?

You'd be hard pushed to find a political leader that hasn't got blood on his hands in one way or another. That is the way it goes, especially when you're fighting for a radical change.

Should Mandela and his men have joined hands, sang kumbaya and have asked very nicely that the government stop oppressing them?

 

[Unarmed Gunman]

Six serious questions OP:

1 - How do you feel about necklacing, and the fact that the ANC used it as a tool of torture on many South Africans, and that it's still done today?

2 - How do you feel about the fact that South Africa has devolved into one of the most dangerous places on earth after the ANC took over, with one of the highest rates of murder, rape and robbery on the planet?

3 - Since Mandela was a lifelong communist, does that mean you also support the state sanctioned theft of private property as Mandela did?

4 - How do you feel about the fact that the most dangerous occupation in the entire world, is that of a White farmer in South Africa, where the annual per capita murder rate is 99 out of 100,000?

5 - How do you explain the fact that as horrible as apartheid was, over 60% of black South Africans say they were better off under that disgusting colonial system than they are under the brutal current system 20 years later?

6 - How do you justify Mandela completely ignoring the AIDS epidemic (He didn't even speak about it until 1997 and that was when he was in Davos, Switzerland - not South Africa), considering that South Africa was hit harder by HIV/AIDS than any other country on the planet?

Sorry for asking real questions, I don't believe in hero worship or media fairy tales.

 

[Fatbat]

Do you think his organisation's killing of civilians was justified?

So he was the leader of ANC and of Umkhonto we Sizwe (created for violence as by Mandela's own words) when they commited multiple bombings, murders (including by necklacing - publicly endorsed by his then wife) and massacres. Are we supposed to believe that all that happened without Mandela's consent?

They fought against an oppressive government that used violence to control and segregate the population. If the same thing happened where you lived you would probably refer to them as freedom fighters.

 

[VonRohn]

You'd be hard pushed to find a political leader that hasn't got blood on his hands in one way or another. That is the way it goes, especially when you're fighting for a radical change.

Should Mandela and his men have joined hands, sang kumbaya and have asked very nicely that the government stop oppressing them?

They fought against an oppressive government that used violence to control and segregate the population. If the same thing happened where you lived you would probably refer to them as freedom fighters.

The vast majority of the people killed were not "white oppressors" but blacks deemed collaborationists and black political opposition members, including kids.

I'm not sure how burning opposition members alive fits the freedom fighter narrative.

 

[quintana]

The vast majority of the people killed were not "white oppressors" but blacks deemed collaborationists and black political opposition members, including kids.

I'm not sure how burning opposition members alive fits the freedom fighter narrative.

Yeah, as you said, they killed the opposition.
Killing kids isn't agreeable. I hate it when our Government does that, too.
But what is your point?

Is it that it was wrong to rise up against an oppressive government?

Is it that you think Nelson did the right thing the wrong way?

Is it that you expected people that have suffered for decades to take out their rage by slaying the opposition as humanly as possible?

or are you saying that Nelson was more evil than them? And that, if we had to distill such a complex situation down to something as basic as "good" vs "evil", Nelson wasn't one of the "good" guys?

 

[n-cube]

I love Mandela.

Ya, what a great man.

Necklacing is so kool, who ain't like it?

<<Me, I'm one of the few proud germans of wf & I am proud of Adolf Hitler, and so proud of Stalin & Mao Zedong.>>

And Kim Kong in North Korea, oh luv'him

As one of the Proud South Africans on Wicked Fire, I thought I would write a few of my thoughts on Nelson Mandela and South Africa from a normal everyday guys perspective.
Who was Nelson Mandela to me? He was a leader that inspired greatness, he was our first Black president, He was the only president in the history of our country that never had a single mention of being corrupt or involvement in any bribery, corruption or any other negative publicity. He was a man of complete integrity. People that met him in person were always amazed that he was so genuinely interested in them and their lives. He had the most incredible sense of humour and would make his presence of greatness felt in any room or place he entered. The humility, the forgiveness and compassion he showed to those that persecuted him, is otherworldly, there is not many words that can describe that. It will more than likely take a century or more for another Human being to be as great as this man. There was just on 90 Heads of state at his Memorial which is the largest gathering ever of so many Heads of State in one place at any given Time Ever!! I am truly blessed to live in this country and being abled to call this home. As Barrack Obama said in his speech, Many world leaders should take an introspective look at themselves and take some lessons from Nelson Rohihlahla Mandela. – Let your Legacy live on Forever.

 

[casteyn]

Lets differentiate the Anc Organization form Nelson Mandela. Keep it in Context and see Nelson Mandela as the Man of compasion that he was. I grew up as a white male, fed with propoganda by the White government at that time. Many Black people and White people still dont support the Anc and current government as there is much room for improvement. Setting that all asside. Nelson Mandela was if you had met him in Person was the kindest, most compasionate, yet Asertive and strong leader we have ever had. If he was anything like the comments made above, Then why does the whole world know his name and know about him? Why then were there close on 90 Heads of Sates, Presidents, Prime ministers, Monarchy, celebrities etc from all countries around the world at his memorial, which as i mentioned, the most gathered together in one place ever? Why is it the biggest broadcasted event ever? This is all due to the Ideals that he lived out that pretty much all of humanity strives for.

 

[Ibanez | Jan]

Yeah, as you said, they killed the opposition.
Killing kids isn't agreeable. I hate it when our Government does that, too.
But what is your point?

Is it that it was wrong to rise up against an oppressive government?

Is it that you think Nelson did the right thing the wrong way?

Is it that you expected people that have suffered for decades to take out their rage by slaying the opposition as humanly as possible?

or are you saying that Nelson was more evil than them? And that, if we had to distill such a complex situation down to something as basic as "good" vs "evil", Nelson wasn't one of the "good" guys?

They didn't just 'kill' the opposition, they tortured them to death.

That's a huge difference imo and it's just disgusting to see all the cocksuckers posting shit like "RIP SAINT" on Facebook when he was partly to blame for the shit that happened.

Can't believe that his wife (she ordered the killing of kids by necklacing them) received the UN human rights price.

'History is always written by the winners.'

 

[n-cube]

P.R

Because it is all about public relations & political gains.

Lets differentiate the Anc Organization form Nelson Mandela. Keep it in Context and see Nelson Mandela as the Man of compasion that he was. I grew up as a white male, fed with propoganda by the White government at that time. Many Black people and White people still dont support the Anc and current government as there is much room for improvement. Setting that all asside. Nelson Mandela was if you had met him in Person was the kindest, most compasionate, yet Asertive and strong leader we have ever had. If he was anything like the comments made above, Then why does the whole world know his name and know about him? Why then were there close on 90 Heads of Sates, Presidents, Prime ministers, Monarchy, celebrities etc from all countries around the world at his memorial, which as i mentioned, the most gathered together in one place ever? Why is it the biggest broadcasted event ever? This is all due to the Ideals that he lived out that pretty much all of humanity strives for.

 

[mattseh]

Then why does the whole world know his name and know about him?

Why then were there close on 90 Heads of Sates, Presidents, Prime ministers, Monarchy, celebrities etc from all countries around the world at his memorial, which as i mentioned, the most gathered together in one place ever?

Why is it the biggest broadcasted event ever?

1. There are plenty of terrible people who are / were famous.

2. They are morally bankrupt parasites.

3. The broadcasters are either state controlled or allied with the state most of the time.

 

[schockergd]

Have you read Mandella's autobiography?

If so, did you feel after reading it that he was anti-violence?

He talks about the church street massacre (Bombing of a busy intersection near a military depot, resulting in the deaths of 19 and wounding of 200, mostly civilians, women and children).

Here's the excerpt from his autobiography -

MK's first car bomb attack took place in May of 1983, and was aimed at an air force and military intelligence office in the heart of Pretoria. This was an effort to retaliate for the unprovoked attacks the military had launched on the ANC in Maseru and elsewhere and was a clear escalation of the armed struggle. Nineteen people were killed and more than two hundred injured. The killing of civilians was a tragic accident, and I felt a profound horror at the death toll. But as disturbed as I was by these casualties, I knew that such accidents were the inevitable consequence of the decision to embark on a military struggle. Human fallibility is always a part of war, and the price for it is always high. It was precisely because we knew that such incidents would occur that our decision to take up arms had been so grave and reluctant. But as Oliver said at the time of the bombing, the armed struggle was imposed upon us by the violence of the apartheid regime.

 

[casteyn]

The biggest braodcasted Event around the world. not just in South Africa!

 

[Ibanez | Jan]

Nelson Mandela was if you had met him in Person was the kindest, most compasionate, yet Asertive and strong leader we have ever had.

People said that about Hitler as well.
What's your point?

If he was anything like the comments made above, Then why does the whole world know his name and know about him? Why then were there close on 90 Heads of Sates, Presidents, Prime ministers, Monarchy, celebrities etc from all countries around the world at his memorial, which as i mentioned, the most gathered together in one place ever? Why is it the biggest broadcasted event ever?

 

[casteyn]

The crazy thing is I and many South Africans thought the way some of the guys that have commented on this thread (negatively) in actual fact much worse than any of the comments, because we lived here through all of this, it was a reality for us. The thing that has now set us apart is that we can change. Many of us have. This change was brought about by Nelson Mandela. You must understand this He not only set himself free, he set his Jailer free as well. If it was not for him, we would have gone into a fully fledged civil war and then our country would have been destroyed with an incredable amount of hatred and far worse atrocities done against both white and black people.

 

[BlokBlok]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7HyuLPWF9I"]The Truth About Nelson Mandela - YouTube[/ame]

 

[DewChugr]

What about the sign language fool?

'Fake' sign language interpreter at Nelson Mandela memorial provokes anger

Comments are great.