US dollar - will keep on keeping on FTW

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Dispel

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This will probably be a little too complicated for the Truthertard and NWO turd crazies to digest, as they, after all are crazy and should really be barcoded and put away somewhere 'safe' asap, but the rest may get something out of it.


love the last line, lol.


This is subscription only content so I am posting the whole thing. Its from here:
Free Article for Non-Members | Stratfor

Geopolitical Diary: Why China Needs U.S. Debt
February 13, 2009 | 0252 GMT
Geopolitical Diary icon

China does not see any choice but to keep buying U.S. government debt, Luo Ping, a director-general at the China Banking Regulatory Commission (CBRC), told a New York risk-managers conference on Thursday.

“Except for U.S. Treasuries, what can you hold? Gold? You don’t hold Japanese government bonds or U.K. bonds. U.S. Treasuries are the safe-haven. For everyone, including China, it is the only option,” The Financial Times quoted Luo as saying. Even if the dollar depreciates because of Washington’s financial bailouts, he added, China does not have any other options.

Luo is acknowledging something of an open secret. Despite occasional hints (or threats) that China might attempt to bankrupt the United States by suddenly selling all of the U.S. debt it holds, that really is not an option. It would destroy China economically in the process, unless there were some alternative place for Beijing to invest. But for a number of reasons, there is none.

Over the past two decades, the United States and China have developed a special relationship based on the safety of U.S. debt. In essence, the United States provides China access to the wealthiest consumer market in the world, which in turn soaks up China’s massive output of consumer goods. This not only provides income for Chinese exporters, but also helps ensure social stability in China by maintaining employment — which is Beijing’s primary economic policy goal. China in turn invests its large trade surpluses, earned in U.S. dollars, into U.S. Treasury debt (e.g. 30-year bonds or 10-year notes). This allows China to store its earnings in one of the largest and most liquid financial markets in the world, without needing to convert between currencies. Meanwhile, the recycling of surpluses into Treasury instruments helps bankroll continued U.S. spending. It is vendor financing on a global scale.

This relationship has fueled unprecedented booms in both U.S. consumer spending and Chinese industrialization. Even in the midst of recession, China continues to sock away savings — but now, because of the financial crisis, many wonder whether U.S. Treasury debt is the best vehicle for storing those funds.

Simply put, it costs a lot to buttress a collapsing financial market. As the cost of U.S. financial bailout efforts piles up, Washington’s balance sheet is deteriorating. Since the credit crisis began in the fourth quarter of 2007, bailouts have put U.S. government commitments at nearly US$9 trillion. To be sure, this is more akin to a line of credit than a tally of actual spending — though the actual federal outlays to date, around US$3 trillion, represent roughly 20 percent of U.S. gross domestic product (GDP) — but the stakes are high and investors are nervous.

China is the largest holder of U.S. government debt, so it is no wonder that Yu Yongding, the head of China’s World Economics and Politics Institute and a former advisor to the central bank, on Wednesday opined that because of its “reckless policies” the United States should “make the Chinese feel confident that the value of the assets at least will not be eroded in a significant way.” His remarks were meant to impress upon Washington that, as the primary financier of U.S. debt, China holds significant power in the relationship.

In general, as a country’s balance sheet comes under increasing strain, investors tend to sell that country’s assets and move their funds to a country with more attractive fundamentals (such as a trade or budget surplus). But the conventional wisdom that U.S. debt is becoming a questionable asset and is about to be dumped by investors has not proven true. Instead, money from all over the world has been flooding into American markets, sending the dollar to its highest levels — and bond yields to their lowest — in years.

U.S. Treasuries remain the primary vehicle for investing surpluses — and in particular Chinese surpluses. The reasons are many. For one, most other countries do not have debt markets large enough to support the level of investment China needs to make. The U.S. debt market is larger than the three next-largest markets combined. Indeed, only Japan has a larger debt market than the United States — but because Japan’s debt represents some 170 percent of its GDP, it has a credit rating no better than that of the better-run states in Sub-Saharan Africa. The U.S. Treasury debt market, while large, represents only about half of the U.S. GDP — a much more manageable fraction.

Of the top ten largest debt markets, the four that are in the eurozone — Germany, France, Italy and Spain — potentially provide viable alternatives for China. However, these also pose problems. Much like Middle Eastern oil states, China not only receives most of its income in dollars, but also effectively pegs its own currency on the dollar. This means that for the Chinese, savings and investments held in dollar-denominated assets are relatively safe, stable and accessible. From Beijing’s perspective, it does not make much sense to convert surplus dollars into euros, only to become more exposed to the risk of currency fluctuations. (And even that assumes that one trusts, for example, Italian financial governance.)

If Beijing does not view euro-based debt as a viable alternative to the United States because of currency stability, it has even less confidence in remaining four of the top ten debt markets, which are denominated in even less stable currencies. The markets for the Brazilian real, the South Korean won, and even the Canadian dollar and British pound are simply too small, fractured and volatile to provide the level of safety of the U.S. dollar. And in any case, all of these markets are much too small to absorb Chinese trade surpluses month after month. Only the regular issuance of multi-billion-dollar debt tranches by the United States, fueled by U.S. budget and trade deficits, can suffice.

If government paper cannot fill its needs, China could turn to commodities — if anything, perhaps gold could provide a viable store of value without subjecting China to the fiscal swashbuckling of a foreign government. But even here, the size of the gold market could not support China’s investment needs. Even if China were somehow able to absorb the total annual output of the world’s gold mines — roughly 80 million troy ounces — doing so would both collapse global debt markets and send gold prices to stratospheric heights. (Not exactly a welcome scenario for a country utterly dependent upon international trade.) And for all that, China could sock away the same amount of value after only about three months of trading with the United States.

Ultimately, steering funds clear of American debt markets is not desirable — or even possible — for the Chinese. Luo, the CBRC director-general (who is known for his colloquial style), put Beijing’s viewpoint about as plainly as it can be put in his speech in New York.

He said: “We hate you guys, but there is nothing much we can do.”

Welcome to my monopoly on truth, btw, please subscribe to my newsletter!
 


China's only a small part of the pie.

From the UK Telegraph

Foreign buyers have absorbed a little over $200bn of Treasuries annually, a useful contribution to financing the $459bn 2008 deficit, but only a modest help towards the $1.35 trillion minimum average deficit forecast for 2009 and 2010.



Unless that changes substantially, there will be $1trillion annually to be raised by the Treasury from domestic sources, more than double the previous record from domestic and foreign sources together, plus whatever is needed to bail out the banks.








http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...bts-about-who-will-buy-all-Americas-debt.html
 
whewww disaster adverted the chinese chose not to collapse and bankrupt the US. Let's continue to be retarded because the smart chinese obviously has our backs and have a strong interest in continuing the american lifestyle.

Does anyone else find this fucked up?

The US government is having to ask china if we're allowed to continue to be a non third world country. Then china starts crunching on the calculators and says....ummmm yeah for now....and we're like SWEET!

I see i like this. China has so much money that without somewhere to put it all it could drastically hurt their economy. We have so much debt that without new credit card offers coming in the mail every day we can't survive. Conspiracy theorist or not, which situation would you rather be in?
 
I see i like this. China has so much money that without somewhere to put it all it could drastically hurt their economy. We have so much debt that without new credit card offers coming in the mail every day we can't survive. Which situation would you rather be in?

China doesn't even have enough water to keep over half its country with clean drinking water. The chinese economy is completely reliant on our economy, even more than the average american family is reliant on it. also, our economy isn't completely propped up by the chinese as that article suggests. not even close. do your own research, and dont trust a bunch of figures thrown out by people saying the sky is falling.
 
The chinese economy is completely reliant on our economy, even more than the average american family is reliant on it.
Not only is that not true but its incredibly misleading. The chinese economy is reliant upon its industrious exports. This is much like the US economy was during the industrial revolution(we didn't have the greatest water back then either). We happen to be one of their biggest customers because we continue to have a very high GNP in contrast to our GDP in match with the rest of the world. The facts stick no matter how you look at it, no nation in the history of the world has ever bought its way out of an economic collapse and savings not spending is the only solution to a weakening currency. To rely 100% on another nation to continue to buy up our debt is absurd. Furthermore China isn't our only threat. There is also a very real possibility of Oil switching to the euro(not to create a confusion of the problem being solely on the currency but it is a factor regardless).
 
Meh. The chinese Central Bank has been the largest buyer of gold in the world for the last year. Those guys are socking it away every single chance they get. They are also buying huge stakes in infrastructure assets all around the world. There isn't anywhere they aren't sliming their tentacles into.

They don't "need" the USA, they just need to trade in their turd dollar-denominated holdings for better assets, and if you look closely at what they are doing, it's exactly that. They just have to do it slowly so nobody panics.

Sheeple are mistaking dollars for money. Dollars are not money, they are fiat. Fiat currency is illusionary.

"Fiat: Fiat money, irredeemable paper currency, not resting on a specie basis, but deriving its purchasing power from the declaratory fiat of the government issuing it."

In other words, dollars are worth exactly the paper they are printed on, and no more. They are backed solely by the "full faith and credit of the government of the United States", which means exactly this: the goobermint's ability to squeeze wealth from its citizens through taxation.

Now look up "money" and "wealth".

Surprise!
 
Meh. The chinese Central Bank has been the largest buyer of gold in the world for the last year. Those guys are socking it away every single chance they get. They are also buying huge stakes in infrastructure assets all around the world. There isn't anywhere they aren't sliming their tentacles into.

They don't "need" the USA, they just need to trade in their turd dollar-denominated holdings for better assets, and if you look closely at what they are doing, it's exactly that. They just have to do it slowly so nobody panics.

Sheeple are mistaking dollars for money. Dollars are not money, they are fiat. Fiat currency is illusionary.

"Fiat: Fiat money, irredeemable paper currency, not resting on a specie basis, but deriving its purchasing power from the declaratory fiat of the government issuing it."

In other words, dollars are worth exactly the paper they are printed on, and no more. They are backed solely by the "full faith and credit of the government of the United States", which means exactly this: the goobermint's ability to squeeze wealth from its citizens through taxation.

Now look up "money" and "wealth".

Surprise!

See if you can hear me through your tin foil hat. We are going to use some actual facts for a second, and not some OMGWTFBBQ the sky is failing, the fed runs everything, our fiat currency is worthless, internet bullshit.

1) The dollar is seen as more stable than other currencies which is why it has grown in value vs BOTH the euro and the pound over the last 6 months

Exchange Rates Graph (American Dollar, Euro)

2) There seems to be no shortage of buyers for Treasury bonds and other debt instruments as investors flee global economic uncertainty for the stability of United States government debt. This is why Treasury yields have plummeted to record lows. (The more investors want notes and bonds, the lower the yield, and short-term rates are close to zero.)

3) The US Govt has never defaulted on its debt, it also has the strongest military on earth, which are two reasons why it's currency is seen as globally the safest bet for foreign governments.

4) if you invested in gold last February (a year ago) you are down roughly 10% right now. Thats right, gold prices relative to US dollars have fallen over the last 12 months (they have also risen over the last 3).
 
Its not about what we want. I really do wish there is no coming economic disaster, but the fundamentals all point to a collapse. This is engineered.

China is not stupid. What is the point of export stuff to a country that provides worthless currency (thanks to all this bailout shit and the "quantitative easing")

Buying U.S. Treasury bonds is an option -- but not the only option -- for China, which is aware that huge debt issuance by Washington would reduce the value of China's existing portfolio, a banking regulator said in remarks published on Friday.

Luo Ping, a director-general at the China Banking Regulatory Commission, was clarifying a Financial Times report that quoted him as saying creditor countries had no choice but to invest their surpluses in U.S. Treasuries.
"For everyone, including China, it is the only option," the FT quoted Luo as saying in New York on Wednesday.


In an elaboration of his remarks, the China News Service paraphrased Luo as saying:"Compared with gold or bonds issued by other countries and regions, U.S. Treasury bonds are still an option (for China).


"But if the U.S. government issues a large amount of Treasury bonds amid efforts to deal with the economic crisis, all investors who hold U.S. Treasuries will suffer losses."
China sees risk from big US debt issuance-official | Markets | Markets News | Reuters

Hence it is still a option and not the ONLY option.
 
1) The dollar is seen as more stable than other currencies which is why it has grown in value vs BOTH the euro and the pound over the last 6 months

The dollar has increased against other currencies because of all the deleveraging thats been taken place. This is only a temporary effect. Even during this deleveraging, ALL currencies are being devalued.
 
4) if you invested in gold last February (a year ago) you are down roughly 10% right now. Thats right, gold prices relative to US dollars have fallen over the last 12 months (they have also risen over the last 3).

Gold has increased it value against the dollar 4+ times over in the last 8 years. Its no point looking at the ripples in a massive wave. This trend will continue as the increase in the money supply lowers the value of the dollar.
 
Folks assume the Chinese have to make goods for people who have to borrow money from the Chinese in the first place to consume it. The average Chinese worker gets the wrong end of the deal, because he works for squat, and what little he saves to get ahead in life, get lent out to people who probably cannot pay it back.

He's be much better off not producing above his consumption level, or producing above his consumption level, and consuming the surplus himself, rather than giving it away basically for free.

It's a myth that people who buy stuff with credit make the world go around. The people who save, invest and produce have always created prosperity. It is the foundation of Say's Law, that production has to lead consumption, or simply, one cannot eat what has not been made first.
 
Same shit, different century..

The west had the same sort of trade imbalance with China in colonial times. Problem was that we wanted to buy stuff that they produced but they didnt want to buy shit that we produced (like guns.. but the Japs did).. so the only way that we could get money from the fuckers was to sell them Opium..

I guess there won't be another Boxer Rebellion then, huh?
We need to get a piece of that Opium trade coming out of Afganastan.
 
The dollar has increased against other currencies because of all the deleveraging thats been taken place. This is only a temporary effect. Even during this deleveraging, ALL currencies are being devalued.

The USD has increased against most currencies because it has been seriously undervalued for the longest time. Plus people actually found out that Europe is even more screwed than the US. Their banks invested a lot in the Baltic states and South America with no hope of ever getting it back, they gobbed up any sub prime mortgages they could get their hands on, Island is bankrupt, Italy and Greece are getting there, Spain is approaching 25% of unemployment, the UKs main industry pretty much collapsed, UBS'/Credit Suisse's obligations by far outstrip the GDP of Switzerland, there's civil unrest in the Baltic States and overall the Banks in Europe are looking at close $16 trillion dollars in "toxic" assets. Add to that that Europe's corporate debt equals close to 95% of the region's economy, while the US right now is at 50% or so, and you know why the USD has been gaining.
 
I recently saw somewhere that 20,000,000 Chinese workers have been laid off in the past couple of months.

Thats like 2/3 the population of Canada unemployed, staggering when you think about it.

The slow down in consumer spending has affected goods orders in China which causes factories to shut down until the sales are back up, which is putting people out of work at an alarming rate in China.
 
The USD has increased against most currencies because it has been seriously undervalued for the longest time. Plus people actually found out that Europe is even more screwed than the US. Their banks invested a lot in the Baltic states and South America with no hope of ever getting it back, they gobbed up any sub prime mortgages they could get their hands on, Island is bankrupt, Italy and Greece are getting there, Spain is approaching 25% of unemployment, the UKs main industry pretty much collapsed, UBS'/Credit Suisse's obligations by far outstrip the GDP of Switzerland, there's civil unrest in the Baltic States and overall the Banks in Europe are looking at close $16 trillion dollars in "toxic" assets. Add to that that Europe's corporate debt equals close to 95% of the region's economy, while the US right now is at 50% or so, and you know why the USD has been gaining.

All currencies are devaluing, its just that the other currencies have devalued more in this period of time. This gives the false impression that the dollar is gaining in value. It is not gaining in value. All this bailout crap will catch up, and when it does, the dollar will collapse.
 
See if you can hear me through your tin foil hat.

Hear ME through YOUR tinfoil hat.

Fiat currency is an illusion. It is backed by absolutely NOTHING. We can print as many as we want whenever we want, and we are.

The only way to not outright default on our debt is to devalue the currency it is denominated in until our creditors say 'enough'. Bernanke made it clear over a year ago that he's gonna print the dollar down to zero. The "presses" are running night and day, at completely nsustainable rates. It's a done deal.

Buy all the Treasuries you want. The dollar is dead, it's just a matter of who gets left holding the bag. I'm thinking its going to be bright guys like you.


PS, gold is not an "investment", it's insurance. I've been buying since it was $550, so I'm a little better than okay.
 
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