lukep - just out of curiosity what is your definition of an MFA farm? A collection of "thin" content sites created for the sole purpose of generating advertising or affiliate revenue?
130k Cash: Should I build 4k MFA's on sand, again?
- Thread starter clyde
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I know you asked lukep but this is my thought,
MFA = meant for advertisement.
i.e: All the sites that any IM'er, affiliates, SEO'er have ever built.
now some might build "quality" ones, some might outsource to India.
They both serve the same purpose.
TO make money off of the motherfckin ADS.
Now what is a MFA-farm.
I remember back then people used (still do) SEO hosting so they can interlink their MFA's for SEO purposes. This should still work, but the AdSense/CB/Analytics ID is a major foot print.
1 way backlink from different, random IP's are the best.
2011 evolution: No farm, just shit loads of MFA's with 1 way links from different IP's.
MFA = meant for advertisement.
i.e: All the sites that any IM'er, affiliates, SEO'er have ever built.
now some might build "quality" ones, some might outsource to India.
They both serve the same purpose.
TO make money off of the motherfckin ADS.
Now what is a MFA-farm.
I remember back then people used (still do) SEO hosting so they can interlink their MFA's for SEO purposes. This should still work, but the AdSense/CB/Analytics ID is a major foot print.
1 way backlink from different, random IP's are the best.
2011 evolution: No farm, just shit loads of MFA's with 1 way links from different IP's.
lukep speaks the truth.
It's all about implementation and monetization diversification. If you follow the $7 WSO step-by-step plan to create a one pager, $3.50 article with adsense on it, then perhaps, yes, you may get banned/slapped, etc... But if you have at least half a brain, then you will evolve your strategy beyond that.
lol... okay "Made For Advertising" is quite a bit different than "Made For Adsense." I'm out of touch with he noob lingo these days.
If I were you, I'd buy around 10 nice money making sites (a mix of adsense and affiliate sites) and also put some money into assets / accounts that don't have anything to do with the internet.
While scouting for sites, I'd choose mid competition niche sites that don't necessarily rank 1-5 for their main keyword(s). I would choose ones that I'm confident to take 1 - 5 (or at least top 10), that show obvious scope for improving monetization (Look for things such as poor adsense deployment - ad formats/colors, no email harvesting, non-utilization of certain link building strategies that would guarantee serp improvement, current use of shaving or bad offers, potential for using better paying CPA offers and so on)
You could also publish more relevant content focusing on totally relevant but unutilized keywords on your niche sites. There are certain types of links / strategies that would GUARANTEE serp improvement and better traffic with a nice ROI if you were doing it for a certain competition level. If you have enough knowledge of SEO, you could do this all with a better profit potential and without having to build hundreds of one-page mfa sites - that may be working right now but have very low chances of transforming into authority sites and will most-probably not work good in the near future.
While scouting for sites, I'd choose mid competition niche sites that don't necessarily rank 1-5 for their main keyword(s). I would choose ones that I'm confident to take 1 - 5 (or at least top 10), that show obvious scope for improving monetization (Look for things such as poor adsense deployment - ad formats/colors, no email harvesting, non-utilization of certain link building strategies that would guarantee serp improvement, current use of shaving or bad offers, potential for using better paying CPA offers and so on)
You could also publish more relevant content focusing on totally relevant but unutilized keywords on your niche sites. There are certain types of links / strategies that would GUARANTEE serp improvement and better traffic with a nice ROI if you were doing it for a certain competition level. If you have enough knowledge of SEO, you could do this all with a better profit potential and without having to build hundreds of one-page mfa sites - that may be working right now but have very low chances of transforming into authority sites and will most-probably not work good in the near future.
Why don't you just call these "MFA Sites" "Websites". *cough*
lol you're right. There's a thin line between them so I guess MFA's have more ads, in a more annoying way that legally confuses visitors into clicking. Sounds good? I'm wiki'ing this.
Why only stick to adcents?
I'm getting a bunch made myself, but whenever I see a better income potential I don't hesitate to give it a shot. Obviously I won't out my niches but let's use the web hosting industry as an example because it's so shitty & saturated to death that I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole.
I could go out there & get 20-50 articles written about the nittry gritty of stuff (siteground has used this strategy to get organic traffic), and outrank all the other cocksuckers for the longtail keywords, but why settle for a few hundred bucks a month when the traffic is pouring in? Because in my experience that's what adsense pays. It's still a positive ROI of course, but you could be making that much everyday if you optimized the site to sell stuff or pitch good offers.
I think this is what the consensus of the nay-sayers is and I agree with the guy who said to set up an office & exploiting some creative newbies. Sober human enthusiasm & creativity is a very valuable commodity.
I'm getting a bunch made myself, but whenever I see a better income potential I don't hesitate to give it a shot. Obviously I won't out my niches but let's use the web hosting industry as an example because it's so shitty & saturated to death that I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole.
I could go out there & get 20-50 articles written about the nittry gritty of stuff (siteground has used this strategy to get organic traffic), and outrank all the other cocksuckers for the longtail keywords, but why settle for a few hundred bucks a month when the traffic is pouring in? Because in my experience that's what adsense pays. It's still a positive ROI of course, but you could be making that much everyday if you optimized the site to sell stuff or pitch good offers.
I think this is what the consensus of the nay-sayers is and I agree with the guy who said to set up an office & exploiting some creative newbies. Sober human enthusiasm & creativity is a very valuable commodity.
Almost. Take the word "Thin" out of there and you're pretty close.
Some of my "MFA sites" are pretty high quality sites with professional-grade content that don't get updated much, not even blogs... Few ppl here would call that MFA but there is no other monetizer behind it.
I submit this better definition for a modern MFA:
A website of any format or quality whose sole purpose is to make money from advertisements or other easily-implemented monetizer like CPA forms, affiliate links, or email opt-ins. It can never be a front to another business; It is a business in itself.
An "MFA Farm" is having tons of these small businesses. This has also been known as a "Virtual Real Estate Empire" since 2007 when John Reece coined that term.
Because there are too many types of websites that don't fit this definition. At the very least there is the half or so of the web that isn't monetizing on the site like personal blogs, organizations, and business fronts. -These are all "Websites." -But not MFAs at all.kidChaos said:
Just out of curiosity, what draws you guys to this model? My experience is that it's sooo much easier to develop 1 quality site that makes as much as 100 of these MFA sites. Have you tried creating a single high quality money site and it didn't work out for you, or are you just drawn to this model because a lot of it can be automated, or ??? Just curious...
The biggest reason for me is the automation. You can scale this; You can't really scale a popular blog very easily other than outsourcing content writers (and I don't want to talk to them in the first place.)
Also I don't like to put all my eggs in one basket. I currently have 350+ baskets that each have the potential to pay my rent every month. I plan to double that number in 2011. -So diversity is the #2 reason for me.
Scale a popular blog? A popular blog can make 100k or more a month ...
I guess I just don't "get" it. Granted you use a lot of automation but you're dicking around with 350+ sites to make $1k a day. You obviously have a head on your shoulders and some skills ... I just don't get it when you could much more easily make $1k a day and more with CPA offers or "regular" affiliate marketing.
So your goal for 2011 is 700+ sites to make $2k a day. I just can't fathom that when you can easily make $2k a day promoting a SINGLE CPA offer with a SINGLE traffic source.
I'm intrigued but guess I still just don't get the logic behind MFA sites... I guess you probably just gravitated towards it the same way I and other gravitate towards other things. Do you think that CPA/affiliate marketing is "hard" and that what you do is easier?
I guess I just don't "get" it. Granted you use a lot of automation but you're dicking around with 350+ sites to make $1k a day. You obviously have a head on your shoulders and some skills ... I just don't get it when you could much more easily make $1k a day and more with CPA offers or "regular" affiliate marketing.
So your goal for 2011 is 700+ sites to make $2k a day. I just can't fathom that when you can easily make $2k a day promoting a SINGLE CPA offer with a SINGLE traffic source.
I'm intrigued but guess I still just don't get the logic behind MFA sites... I guess you probably just gravitated towards it the same way I and other gravitate towards other things. Do you think that CPA/affiliate marketing is "hard" and that what you do is easier?
Yes, they can, but so can a good MFA farm... And no great content need be written. I've actually had 1 single site make over $1200 DAILY in Adsense alone back during the height of the Acai berry craze, so it can be done... Of course it's not too common.
Well a single blog, to get traffic, must "Dick around" with a lot of content writing. I haven't written content in years.
I don't know exactly where you got the idea that I make $1k a day with my 350 sites, but you seem to have some sort of fear of owning too many sites... For me it's just the opposite... I fear owning too few, because I know that the more I own, the more money I make, and the more regular the earnings, no matter what happens out there in the world to shut a niche down.
Owning 1 blog, even if it has a million uniques daily, seems like a short-term project to me. Oprah or someone could move into that niche and it's goodbye to your one stream of income.
Oprah HAS moved into one of my niches and I'm not really any worse for the wear because I am in so many niches at once. That's diversification.
I gravitated towards hands-free income.
I know there is still upkeep to be done, but nothing that is time sensitive. I can literally get on a plane for Fiji tonight, leave my PC behind, vacation hard for a year, and return to a strong income stream.
Once I master automating one or two more things around here, the upkeep doesn't even need to be done by me, ever. I could literally make my 700 sites, and sit back and receive the cash forever, no computer needed.
What does it matter if other people are writing the content for you? I'm not suggesting that you or I would actually write much content.
You said so in one of the recent threads about goals. You said you're currently making around $1k a day and your goal is $3k a day.
A good site in a good niche can't be "shut down".
I don't have a fear of owning a lot of sites, but all else being equal, I've just found it's a lot easier to manage and grow a few sites vs. 100s. Not sure how anyone could really argue with that...
You keep saying blog blog blog. I guess you've found something that really works for you so that's great. In my world there are so many different ways to make money online that it's weird to me that you just keep saying blog blog blog. I guess I was just curious if you've ever tried anything else...
A well established quality site shouldn't have to worry about Oprah or anyone else putting them out of business, unless it's a very specific site that does only one very specific thing with no barrier to entry. Oprah couldn't put a dent in my income if her life depended on it.
That's awesome. That's the part I'm still working on as well.
Other humans don't write my content either.
Good catch... Forgot that I'd ratted myself out there.
So let me get this clearly; you have a site of some kind (obviously not a blog
) that sells something. Let's call it a blue widget.If Oprah got into the Blue Widget market tomorrow, had all her fans talking about her brand of blue widgets, and her site became the new #1-#10 listings in google for blue widgets from that day forward, you wouldn't lose any sales??
Sorry, I should have included other sites in with blogs. Of course there are many more ways, just as their are in MFAs.
Personally I've tried quite a lot. Since 2004 I've been trying every system I could. I have even had a few modest successes outside of MFAs; I won't mention any here by name because I think know a few people here who have been paid members on a membership site of mine.
Also a product review blog in the IM niche did ok as long as I manually kept it up, & I've sold an ebook that I wrote before, and I've even held product launches as well as have been the #1 affiliate for other people's launches too. I'm no stranger to aweber but I honestly would like to be.MFAs to me represent the least amount of work for the maximum payback... It's just not instant money. -And you collect the payback over a long period of time.
Instead of thinking of $1k days, an adsense farmer really should be aiming to make sites that each makes 1,000x their domain costs over their lifetime.
Let that set in for a second. If I rent a .com domain for $8 a year for 5 years, that's $40. To "break even" that domain needs to only make $40 back in 5 years time. (Ok, hosting costs eat up a little more, but let's keep this simple.)
Naturally you want it to do much better, so I set a lifetime Goal per site of 1000 times that amount ($40k per 5 years) just for the one site...
No, I don't acheive it often but I do not make any MFA sites that I do not believe have the potential to make that level of income.
Each site is a business, or some would say an "Assett." A hands-free business if made well... So In reality, I prefer to think of each of my sites as an investment, like a high-yield stock portfolio that pays constant dividends.
So let me get this clearly; you have a site of some kind (obviously not a blog
If Oprah got into the Blue Widget market tomorrow, had all her fans talking about her brand of blue widgets, and her site became the new #1-#10 listings in google for blue widgets from that day forward, you wouldn't lose any sales??
Absolutely. The key is I don't sell blue widgets, or any other commodity type product where a unique selling proposition doesn't exist or where some type of advantage can't be had (by me).
Imagine, just as one simple example, a scenario where you were basically arbitraging leads. You ran a low paying short form lead gen offer on the front end, and you funneled those leads into one or more related higher paying offers on the back end. You got all of your traffic from affiliates, and doubled your money on every $1 you paid out to your affiliates.
You're not at the mercy of Google or Oprah, or anyone else. The only thing required for this to work is your ability to get the conversions and the numbers where they need to be, and there's absolutely nothing and no one who can stop you from doing it. That's just one example off the top of my head...
BTW a simple arbitrage model like this can make six figs a month with a single offer.
I like a lot of what you're saying. I guess the big question is how certain are you that your little assets will prove to be long term assets, especially if you don't continue to work on them?
Is it realistic to think that thin MFA sites will continue to make money for 5 years?
I guess the main premise with your system is that you need to be confident that you will ALWAYS be able to work around any algo changes that Google makes. If you can then I guess you're set, but if not then you're screwed. I would have to be pretty darn confident to justify spending a bunch of time and money on MFAs ... I guess you are.
dsiomtw, lukep is a member at the other WF forum (username: LMC?), I believe he does 3k+/day not 1k+.
I used to aim for sites with lower profitability but now I'll only do sites that make $10/day minimum. I may not need 4k websites after all.
HOW DARE YOU! That's just too much to accuse anyone of around here... I demand a duel! Pistols at dawn? :ugone2far:
Seriously, I'm not LMC, although I did have a profile at WaFo years ago.
That's a good way to approach it too, although since you really can't know what the traffic fluctuations in the short term are going to be I prefer to estimate the lifetime value of each property now.
