$1000 Litecoin!!!

[Thorn]

Cryptos are from nature a a financial share not a money.

The sentence got destroyed as i edited it.

It must be:

Cryptos are from nature a financial share not a currency. You can use them as money of course but you can use all as money. From glas pearls to shell money to paper.

Even dog shit would work, btw. And it would work good because its a self refreshing and constant avaible but limited resource. A joke, yes, but with a serious background - the mechanism is 100% valid. I read once a paper about it which used it to describe the mechanism.

 

[o hai guyz]

^ What you're saying has been discussed many times and is only valid for the current time period. Bitcoin *should* eventually stabilize around a specific exchange rate and volatility will decrease significantly, making it an ideal method of payment. Currently it behaves like a commodity rather than a currency due to the fact that it's very new and the demand is out of whack.

I believe what luke is getting at with the comparison though is that litecoin has no reason to grow because it's just a bitcoin ripoff and provides nothing better that would cause people to have more faith in it. It also isn't accepted by any merchants, the govs don't care about it, and it hasn't gotten any news coverage - these are all things that have driven bitcoin's recent growth, therefore it doesn't make sense for litecoin's growth to be better than bitcoin's if it hasn't benefited from any of the factors that have caused bitcoin's growth.

Personally, I bought a lot of LTC when it was cheap, so I hope it continues to increase. But I'm not the type of investor to just blindly believe that something is good simply because I've invested in it, and I wouldn't be surprised if litecoin crashes soon (but what do I know, these cryptos just do whatever the fuck they want).

 

[kryaa]

This reminds me of the days i thought i could earn money with "HYIPs" (read: Ponzi Scheme). You just had to be the first to learn about them. Then there was this "Star Program" 1% per day ....running for over a year.... a-mazing, the Opportunity of a LIFETIME

Not too forget mpacts reverse pyramid system who even sent me a fancy contract to sign!

Next Stop: Shiitecoin

 

[Thorn]

Sorry, but everyone who believe that there can be a "stabilized and specific exchange rate" for a limited resource like BTC as base of our economy and working currency did not understood even the fundamentals of economy.

Thats not a question of believe.

That kind of system is only working if you change the whole mankind to a static system too.

So, the only thinkable way you get that realized what you say is that you install something like Huxleys "brave now world".

There it should work - because you eliminated the mechanism needed for capitalism.

 

[lukep]

To believe that their is a difference between BTC and LTC is nonsense.

How can it? they are both calculated "mathematical numbers".

Don't be a tard.

I bet you believe that gold has 'intrinsic value,' too.

Please go learn some things about what makes anything worth anything and report back to us here how tardy you are now.

#KTHXBYE

 

[slayerment]

 

[lukep]

WOLOLOLOLOLOL

Fundamentals don't have to be assets, liabilities and personnel, you know. Those are all just things that get added up to approximate value.

Clearly a bunch of things are currently being added up to approximate the value of a bitcoin. -Just because you don't agree with them doesn't mean they don't exist.

 

[Thorn]

Don't be a tard.

I bet you believe that gold has 'intrinsic value,' too.

You mean the fact that gold needed a super novae or the clash of neutron stars to get created, that gold is limited compared to other elements and that it offers special physical behaviours are no intrinsic values? Hmmm....

Anyway - who cares. Gold is not important for our model of economy.

I personally believe one thing:

That everyone who have visions or knowledge of a new social order (that is what we really talk about not btc or any other shit) because he gets now deeper insights driven by money/god/sex or whatever is perhaps more a tard as i ever be will.

 

[lukep]

You mean the fact that gold needed a super novae or the clash of neutron stars to get created, that gold is limited compared to other elements and that it offers special physical behaviours are no intrinsic values? Hmmm....

I mean the idea of intrinsic value is a complete myth. It is a lie. It's what people who sell gold convince people like you exists when it does not.

Anyway - who cares. Gold is not important for our model of economy.

It should be cared about because if you still believe that intrinsic value exists at all, then you are mentally incapable of knowing what anything is worth.

I personally believe one thing:

That everyone who have visions or knowledge of a new social order (that is what we really talk about not btc or any other shit) because he gets now deeper insights driven by money/god/sex or whatever is perhaps more a tard as i ever be will.

That was pretty hard to follow, but I think it was meant to be an insult.

We are talking about the value of litecoins versus bitcoins on this thread. I have no idea why you think we are talking about "new social orders," but perhaps that got lost in translation.

 

[wayn3]

Blessed are those poor in spirit, for theirs is the Kingdom of heaven

 

[microphone head]

I bet you believe that gold has 'intrinsic value,' too.

I can see some intrinsic value to gold when it comes to cryptocurrency. It is used in the electronics that build the systems that compose the BTC network at least.

 

[spanic]

Anybody wants to sell me 2 bitcoins for paypal money? I want to buy some altcoins but cavirtex takes forever to verify my account..

 

[Kiopa_Matt]

Geez luke, when you jump onto an idea, you just go full speed off the cliff with it, don't you? Saying gold has no value is about the equivalent of saying diamonds, wood, and oil are useless, even though we're dependent on all four for our daily lives.

Instead, you could be arguing something like bitcoin has value because it's going to eventually completely blow open the entire landscape of online payments. Considering it's 2014, the state of online payments is a little sad.

With bitcoin though, no registration, virtually no fees, no account verification & ID requirements, everyone worldwide is accepted, never worry about account limitations, instant, and no registration even. Those are some pretty good upsides.

Who knows, but I'm guessing sometime in the future bitcoin will begin to lose steam, say around $10k or so. At that point, there's going to be alot of people sitting on bitcoins, and many are going to be scared just to pull them out to their bank account, so they'll begin spending them online. If you started with a moderate amount, and ended up with $2mil, that's some pretty decent startup capital for your next online venture.

And by then, you'll be able to buy everything needed online -- hosting, developers, designers, media buys, content, whatever.

 

[jacky8]

Even if I just wanted to make a buck speculating, I ain't touching litecoin because there are no fundamentals driving it.

Bitcoin has all the reason in the world to keep shooting up for years until it is the global reserve currency; but litecoin? It's a spare-parts pool... A developer's testing environment that no one wants to take as money at their businesses. Nothing at all that is driving bitcoin's price up is also driving litecoin's price up, outside of a few random guesses.

On the other hand, whatever is driving up its' price may be some kind of link or tether to bitcoin's price... It's not pure tulip mania either, but that doesn't mean it can't crash back down to a dollar again.

I wonder how that opinion would change once you get a few litecoins

 

[lukep]

I can see some intrinsic value...

Then you're doing it wrong bro.

The idea of 'Intrinsic Value' itself is nothing more than a myth. Nothing has an intrinsic value... This is just caveman (or conman) speak to explain something that is otherwise hard to conceptualize.

Humans value things for their perceived functionality. Gold is valued by jewelry makers and circuitboard makers differently... But there is a widely-agreed-upon price for an ounce of gold that reflects where these two valuers 'meet halfway' on their prices for it. (Among others.)

Gold IS worth something, because of its' many uses. It is not Intrinsically worth what it is worth; but it is widely valuable because other people will want to use it in their crafts, but more importantly, they will accept it in trade. This makes gold a commodity.

-Not a money, nor even a currency, but it does show that gold is worth something, just like bitcoin.

Where Guerilla and I differ on this subject is all about how we personally value these two items. Guerilla doesn't believe in intrinsic value either, but he does seem to think that the long history of gold helps determine what gold is 'worth' and he doesn't trust the scarcity of bitcoin.

I however don't feel history has any say what gold is worth (see: beads, seashells) & I trust the scarcity created by the blockchain FAR more than the scarcity of gold's existence in the soil of this planet.

"What we have found so far here" is what determines gold's scarcity. Mathematical Fact is what determines bitcoin's scarcity. Seems a really safe bet to me which one is more valuable from that aspect.

But then bitcoin is very much a multi-function tool... Gold doesn't even attempt to compete with bitcoin's ability to instantly & cheaply transport itself anyplace else on the planet. Gold can't be stored in your brain alone, allowing for deniability. Gold also isn't as effortlessly & evenly divisible as a bitcoin is.

Nor is gold as fungible as bitcoin, because you can find gold that is worth more than the standard price because it was used in artwork or is part of a historical artifact... Or it could be harder to extract for some reason in the first place, or once extracted it could be made into 14 karat, 18 karat, or 24 karat, etc... Gold isn't very fungible at all in fact, which will forever stop it from being useful as money.

And don't get me started on newer uses for bitcoin! Just take my word for it here, bitcoin has far more value to offer the world than shiny lumps of metal ever did, and eventually the old dinosaurs of economics like Guerilla will be using the bitcoin network in 20 different ways every day like we do the internet today...

Hopefully THEN they'll be able to realize that bitcoin is useful enough to deserve a multi-thousand-dollar ask price each.

Anybody wants to sell me 2 bitcoins for paypal money? I want to buy some altcoins but cavirtex takes forever to verify my account..

Lol; no.

Geez luke, when you jump onto an idea, you just go full speed off the cliff with it, don't you? Saying gold has no value...

I didn't say that at all Matt... Read my answer to microphone head above.

What a wasted epic rant. D'oh!

I wonder how that opinion would change once you get a few litecoins

I've had them before and sold them for bitcoins.

I wonder how your opinoin on litecoins would change once you read this: The Problem with Altcoins

 

[cheshire]

Love litecoin, turned my 2btc into 4.5btc in a 2 days. Basically turned $850 into $4500 in 48 hours.

 

[o hai guyz]

Gold IS worth something, because of its' many uses. It is not Intrinsically worth what it is worth; but it is widely valuable because other people will want to use it in their crafts, but more importantly, they will accept it in trade. This makes gold a commodity.

Is gold's price actually indicative of its uses? I thought its price mainly just came from the fact that it's shiny and people equate it with value.

Anybody wants to sell me 2 bitcoins for paypal money? I want to buy some altcoins but cavirtex takes forever to verify my account..

I'll sell you some for straight up cash but not paypal (if you're willing to pay a 35% premium over the exchange prices for the extra effort).

 

[microphone head]

The idea of 'Intrinsic Value' itself is nothing more than a myth. Nothing has an intrinsic value... This is just caveman (or conman) speak to explain something that is otherwise hard to conceptualize.

Luke - I agree with you on so many points in assorted threads but I feel you're confusing 'intrinsic' with 'extraneous' here.

Gold's intrinsic value is what is contained within it - it's properties. It's extraneous value is what jewelers give it.

 

[lukep]

Is gold's price actually indicative of its uses? I thought its price mainly just came from the fact that it's shiny and people equate it with value.

Well, in gold's 6000 year role as a commodity/money, it mostly was more indicative than not. A lot of that time, up until electronics used it, gold was percieved to be worth X amount mainly because some king somewhere would always need it for his next crown.

These days it serves slightly different uses (focusing on the store of value aspect) because so many people have access to it, and of course US politicians like FDR & Nixon were evil sacks of goatshit.

Luke - I agree with you on so many points in assorted threads but I feel you're confusing 'intrinsic' with 'extraneous' here.

Nope, I mean intrinsic. This page defines what I mean pretty well: Intrinsic vs. Extrinsic Value (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)

Gold's intrinsic value is what is contained within it - it's properties. It's extraneous value is what jewelers give it.

It's properties are what jewelers say they are. The only thing contained within gold is the element Au.

 

[Moxie]

The idea of 'Intrinsic Value' itself is nothing more than a myth. Nothing has an intrinsic value

What would Wickedfire be without arguments over semantics.

There doesn't have to be an agreed upon definition of "intrinsic value" to understand some of the points that people like Peter Schiff are trying to make.

A sponge or a bottle of juice purchased from the dollar store has more "<INSERT TERM> value" than a hundred dollar bill (AKA a small piece of paper). The hundred dollar bill, though, currently has more "<INSERT DIFFERENT TERM> value" than those items.

Schiff isn't going to recommend you trade a hundred dollar bill for a sponge any time soon, just like he probably once wouldn't have suggested trading a "$100 Beanie Baby" for the same. However, he would have probably warned about the potential for much lower Beanie Baby "values" due to speculators exiting the game and such.

I however don't feel history has any say what gold is worth (see: beads, seashells) & I trust the scarcity created by the blockchain FAR more than the scarcity of gold's existence in the soil of this planet.

"What we have found so far here" is what determines gold's scarcity. Mathematical Fact is what determines bitcoin's scarcity. Seems a really safe bet to me which one is more valuable from that aspect.

But then bitcoin is very much a multi-function tool... Gold doesn't even attempt to compete with bitcoin's ability to instantly & cheaply transport itself anyplace else on the planet. Gold can't be stored in your brain alone, allowing for deniability. Gold also isn't as effortlessly & evenly divisible as a bitcoin is.

These type of things can also be applied to "Gay Webmaster Coins" or "Super Duper Digital Space Unicorns."

I wonder how your opinoin on litecoins would change once you read this: The Problem with Altcoins

So basically this article is saying that most of the positives you give above and elsewhere about Bitcoin aren't really of that much "<INSERT TERM> value" because Litecoin (and all the present and future others) can easily contain the same features.

They point out that what Bitcoin has going for it is "history and community", which is something beyond the digital item itself. - "Extrinsic value" is just a phrase that humans came up with to describe such a thing.

The only thing contained within gold is the element Au.

Yeah, it is a physical item; whereas Bitcoins are digital ones and zeros stored on hard drives (which contain gold).