4/20 - Happy Birthday!

Do you really think I would start off with something so silly as "killing is bad"?? Me?? Cmon now. I'm a huge fan and supporter of natural selection. Be serious niyya.

Agreed. Natural selection and collateral damage in war (even amongst the general population), although sad is necessary.

A debate isn't about trying to convince one side to change their view or argument, its all about presenting your argument to a judge/judges and having them grade the relevance of logic and presentation effectiveness of arguing/debating a topic.

Agreed. But having a debate on this matter would be rather pointless and biased - unless it somehow consisted of a diversified panel of judges. lol. Seeing I'm far outnumbered with my political beliefs, whatever the outcome - I'll fail. For example; Rudolf Hess - he got sentenced to life in prison for trying to fly into Britain in an attempt to create peace amongst the nations long before the war; = failed.

I've never really bothered to care about Dresden's views or lulz that he posts, because its all just drivel and somewhat entertaining.

Entertainment is needed here, well played sir.

His views hold zero weight in my world. I could care less what he thinks or believes, just as he can care less about mine I'm sure.

Agreed. No rike Jews >:-/

I respect him in business, and I know he certainly respects me in business too.

Agreed.

But there is one major difference that exists that I'd like to point out and hit home with everyone here....

Dresden is a traitor. That's a fact.

The US declared war on Hitler and his Nazis. They are a sworn enemy. We made peace with Germany after they surrendered to us unconditionally. But the Nazi party itself has not. They never gave up. Even after the war was officially declared to be over, they still fought on, like the idiots they are. (Idiots = Determined individuals) That's why Americans whom associate themselves with the Nazis, are considered both enemies of the state and traitors, alike (Am I a traitor of this nation to define me as a traitor? I'd say no seeing we have the ability to study any religion or political belief we desire. Am I an outcast for my political beliefs, maybe even an extremist? I agree. National Socialism is a live and well in my heart, I'm german by blood but irregardless - all aryan tribes (russians, etc even) are allowed to follow this doctrine). This does not make us traitors, falling against my beliefs as a national socialist however, would make me a traitor. If given the chance to rise up again and pick a side, they would, without a shred of doubt choose the Nazi side (in a second), believing they are going to get what they have believed all this time (even if failure was imminent, nurmut! Fight to the death). However, if that day ever comes again, they will be treated as second class citizens under a Nazi regime (maybe, unless of course we could trace our roots back to the country (which I could to Bremen), similar to how the Schutzstaffel had to do so prior to joining. I think the second class citizens would be defined as lower class aryan breeds; example: those from spain, italy or those classified as Mediterranean as outlined when they researched the three classifications of race defined as aryan in the 1930s.). Because they are not Germans, nor are they 100% Aryans as they believe (When Hitler was taken to court and sentenced where he wrote Mein Kampf - he was asked if he was German seeing he was born an Austrian. This said, his response was "Are you talking about a peice of paper, or the blood that flows through my veins?". This said, I think you're referring to me being an American by paper, but again - German by blood"); . But I won't get into that shit now because its actually in my best interest to not convince them otherwise, and have them run straight into a wall and die if that wall were to come back again.

The Nazis are also responsible for industrializing genocide and being.. okay with it, believing to their core that they are doing the right thing. (Mass murder by not just people, but by regiments and armies have been done long before wwii. Maybe in modern television history you may be right but irregardless if this is your argument, they may have just industrialized it by a few months. Other forms of mass murder outside of "evil nazi germany"? (lektion eins) August 6-9 1945; the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagaski; ONE HALF A FUCKING MILLION PEOPLE WERE SET ABLAZE BY THE AMERICAN ARMY. No, the United States didn't send in special forces to snipe out 1, 20, 100 military leaders (similar to Germanys; Nacht der langen Messer - night of the long knves). The United States straight up went over 2 cities and dropped fucking atomic bombs on innocent cavilians. How the fuck does this make the United States better? (lektion zwei) February 13-15, 1945 the beloved United States dropped an assload of bombs on the innocent yet again, civilian city of Dresden (my daughter named in remembrance of this atrocity). Again, half a million dead. Should I go into the atrocities committed by 'mother russia' and opposing countries? The germans did nothing wrong.

Yes, I am Jewish. Yes, the Nazis killed off my grandparents' families and friends. Yes, two of my grandparents, along with a few uncles, aunts and cousins survived the atrocities that the Nazis carried out on their lives as children. Yes, I absolutely despise Nazis, and all that they have done and stand for. (Yeah it sucks that this happened to you.. Regardless of what race, religion, etc someone may be losing family does indeed suck. I lost only one family member during wwii in germany - but this was in an act of war, having that person die when innocent would piss me off I suppose. Like for example; they were sleeping in bed at night in dresden and got raided on, I'd have a vendetta.)

More people should hate the Nazis for what they really are (What are they? Leaders in technology at the time? A nation that struck down the treaty of versailles and gave the country back to its own people? This has nothing to do with racism, because when the AMericans were fighting these evil nazis they were coming home to blacks having separate bathrooms, not being allowed on the sidewalk, cant vote, was illegal to intermary, etc. etc. etc). Perhaps many of you are unaware of the Nazis and their appetite for murdering children (This my friends, don't get pissy Jon - is a Jew trying to push Jewish propaganda amongst the masses to try and pursued the crowd. This happens all over television everyday, detour attention to try and create a reason to hate. But this propaganda put aside; (1) Did the Russian enter Berlin and rape women and yes, children when entering the beloved country? Yes. I wonder how many lil babies were killed in the wonderful evenings of both Nagasaki, Hiroshima and Dresden (lets say combined)??? Yeah, nuff said because I bet you it was a shit load... . Not just through the gas chambers (the gas chambers were actually built for the SS/Nazis to kill more people, quicker, cheaper, and on a high capacity/volume basis) I mostly agree with this. The germans were getting blood, spit and ass all over them when running them into the trenches and shooting them all. Anyone who is human would feel bad, even if it was a hated enemy. This said, they created the chambers to be more cost efficient, quicker, cheaper, and on a high volume basis. MY PERSONAL OPINION ON MASS GENOCIDE; would be to first give the people an option to flea (in which case I'm sure 99% would), then force them out 'by any means necessary'. I personally think Heinrich Himmler (and Karl and llse koch) were lunitics that gave us a bad name. I despise Himmler for the anti-christian type beliefs he had, and he was more into the genocide (not eichmann) part of things . . Perhaps you should take some time out and look into how the Nazis treated all women and children from both Russia and Poland (addressed this above, same can be said with opposing countries). What they actually did to them, with gravity, knives, bullets and fire alone is unlike anything you will ever see (Jewish propaganda, read above to see conflicting statements from opposing countries).

To me, the Nazis represent a good idea to some, through absolute shock and awe tactics, coupled with 100% brutality and cruelty as a standard practice.

agreed
 


I don't hate Germany. I just hate Nazis.

disagreed

When Americans or British raise up the Nazi flag, or claim that Hitler was a great man and had the right idea (he was great at rallying up the crowds, failed at pretty much everything else once given the chance to prove himself), or try and convince everyone else that they are right, I strongly believe they deserve to live life for one week as a Jew (I'd rather shoot myself in the face or lick a black cops asshole), or as a Russian civilian. Since that's impossible, to truly experience that for just one week, they should at least be subjected to the REAL viewpoint of the cruelty that the Nazis doled out on ALL nations they conquered. They were nice here and there to some, but for the most part, they were one big cruelty machine of death and destruction, with a giant smile on their face. How is that something you can be proud of (very proud of it, again in all acts of war you will have collateral damage and loss. The point to all wars is to have more of a positive approach and accept the negative that comes with it. Ultimately, the goals of Germany at the time far outweighed the possible negatives. I very much agree and am extremely proud of what the country did, what my grandfather stood for, and the cause we still fight even today. Hundreds of millions of people fought and died not just in Germany, but throughout history believing in a very similar doctrine. Rest assured, I'm not the only one who feels this way. I'm sure many do even on this forum, they are just to sheep to speak it.)? That's got nothing to do with being Aryan or white... Any cruel person can do that.

So now what?
wait, wut?

tumblr_m5ex1rkjLW1rwgh7wo1_500.jpg


If Hitler was such a brilliant man, why didn't he follow his own published advice of not opening up a two front war that he, himself, proclaimed to be the single greatest mistake Germany made to lose WW1?? I mean, the US had a two front war (smashing the shit out of the Japanese and the Nazis)... The Russians also had a two front war simultaneously (defeating the Nazis and duking it out with the Japanese on the Asian land front). And yet the all mighty Nazis, who were actually far superior in both military technology and tactics (agreed), seemed to just be unable to win (due to greed).. They even had their oh so brilliant God of a leader, Hitler, at the helm... So.. why didn't they win???

Well, in my honest opinion - it's not like I speak for historians, but with my opinion - greed. They failed because the Fuhrer was to greedy and wanted to much living space (lebensraum). Remember; the oh so powerful Fatherland took over 16 fuckin countries, some even in days - what other nation do you know of that has done this? That's right, none. This so called America has been at war with the middle east, for how long? That's right... But wait, that's not a war its a jewish reason to control the masses based on oil and other resources. But the reason imo that Germany didn't fight a strong two-front war, was perdominately due to russia's size and it was prioritized. Also this only happened at the end, because it faught two-fronts several times but only failed in the end.


Because they are Nazis. And Nazis are only good at being cruel bastards and bullies (meeeh, based on jewish tv - again see above to see how cruel apposing nations were). Nothing else. They suck at life itself (which is why there aren't many of them around) - the belief is alive in many, it's just not a popular belief. You of all people should know about mind control and how easy it is to manipulate people through propaganda through media outlets. Out of sight, out of mind - they aren't around because they are not allowed to be around based on media). They blame all problems on everyone around them.. but not on themselves. They use Jews as a crutch and claim that Jews are all powerful bullies and that's why they need to be murdered en masse (well they shouldn't have murdered Jesus (waiting for LOL rebuttals. They were also the reason for the falling of many things; such as the great depression, the failure of wwi, and other things). Same with the Russians (Germany only hated the Russians based on the communist ideas. Russians are very much Aryan).. And everyone else that doesn't agree with them (with us, or against us - I agree. Explains why I never give in and always speak my mind which I know, is not popular at the moment :-).

You know, if you're going to run around and proclaim Hitler as a great leader and man, you may as well just declare Osama Bin Laden as the same (There is no comparison, what do they have in common? Wait, the infamous gun control bans? Remember The gun control regulations were formed in 1919 based on yes, the Jewish idea of Treaty of Versailles. This was long before the Fuhrer came into power. But in 1938 The German Weapons Act was passed allowing the citizens to have firearms once again, except of course for the Jews which were an enemy of the state (similar to how illegal immigrants today shouldnt be allowed firearms). If you want a better argument and comparison to Obama, you can use Feinstein.. because that's what they both have in common. They are both after the same impossible dream, they are both weak little peons (Hitler was not weak, look at all he accomplished my jewish friend :-). They both break every rule they make others follow and die for, and when it comes time to do things their loyal followers do everyday for them (somewhat agreed, yeah hitler did impose a few things to control the masses. But again it was for the greater good. Obama's intentions however, are not)... they end up showing their true colors of being nothing more than pathetic little wimps trying to take the easy way out as quickly as they can.

You, Mr Dresden and all of your fellow Nazi lovers, are fucking weak and pathetic (Willing to speak out, fight and defend what you believe in is not weak imo. National Socialists are indeed very strong people. Remember, even when the walls were collapsing and as you said above - national socialism continued to fight on even after all was lost - this my friend is determination). You are championing a losing ideology (this might be the case in 2013 since the jews are doing a good job at pushing multiculturalism, but if for sake of argument I was the last white man on earth and 6 billion stood against me - I'd fight on, even knowing there would be nothing left to reproduce with). You will always be a minority because as foolish as most humans are, they know a batshit crazy fuckhead when they see one, and more so, most people cannot be cruel and crazy at the same time.

So go fuck yourself. It's a mutual feeling[/QUOTE]

...Now get back to work, shit took like an hour to write.
 
FUCK THAT WAS ALOT. OK SO I GOTTA JOB YA FUCKS. i JUST WANTED TO CELEBRATE THE FUHRERS BIRTHDAY AND REMIND YOU ALL OF A WONDERFUL, AMAZING GERMAN LEADER. ILL TRY MY HARDEST TO REPLY TO ANY STUPID ASS RESPONSES OPPOSING THIS, BUT I AM THE 1% ON THIS THREAD THAT ACTUALLY MAKES A DOLLA. ;-=) 88
 
How is the U.S. nuking Japan similar to the Nazis slaughtering their own civilians? The U.S. was in a war with Japan and they calculated that nuking them would elicit complete surrender.

It was a strategic move. And it worked.

And that is somehow equal to the Nazis rounding up their own unarmed civilian Jew population and slaughtering them? What utter trash.

The Nazis murdered the Jews because they thought they were an inferior subhuman type of species. It didn't have anything to do with winning the war.

Why don't you just admit that, Dresden, instead of making this ridiculous comparison to Hiroshima? Actually, I know why. Because it's damn near impossible to defend the notion of murdering Jews simply because they're Jews.
 
non-aggression principle defined:
Any unsolicited actions of others that physically affect an individual’s property or person, no matter if the result of those actions is damaging, beneficial, or neutral to the owner, are considered violent or aggressive when they are against the owner’s free will and interfere with his right to self-determination or the principle of self-ownership.

when people ignore this (or are ignorant of) and instead associate themselves with collectives (whether it be a government, ethnicity, religion, etc..) and use that classification as justification to do x, y and/or z, that's how you breed hate, war, racism, intolerance, etc..

so the thing that a Nazi and an American patriot has in common is the belief and adherence to a political system; a branding, a sheep.
 
So the 245,000+ death toll in Hiroshima isn't a problem for you?! If someone was to mention the 3000 death toll on 9/11 as not being a problem you'd quickly see your arse.

Innocent people died. No fucking difference.

Are you even understanding what I'm saying? In war, it's kill or be killed. Nuking Hiroshima and Nagasaki won the war, so from a strategic standpoint it was a complete success.

But murdering their civilian Jewish population had nothing to do with winning the war, so the comparison doesn't apply. The Nazis murdered the Jews because they believed them to be genetically inferior, not because they had no other choiice.
 
But murdering their civilian Jewish population had nothing to do with winning the war, so the comparison doesn't apply. The Nazis murdered the Jews because they believed them to be genetically inferior, not because they had no other choiice.

You're forgetting that those dirty Jews were the ones who started the war. World Jewery was the ultimate enemy which needed to be defeated. They were the ones taking over the world. The Jews, not the Nazis, the Jews!

tumblr_mdjtbmkjx61rp7g3w.gif
 
Are you even understanding what I'm saying? In war, it's kill or be killed. Nuking Hiroshima and Nagasaki won the war, so from a strategic standpoint it was a complete success.

But murdering their civilian Jewish population had nothing to do with winning the war, so the comparison doesn't apply. The Nazis murdered the Jews because they believed them to be genetically inferior, not because they had no other choiice.

Was it really necessary though?! I thought the Japs were broke and close to surrender. The US at the time saw their entire population as vermin and were ready to drop even more bombs on them. The point is, as twisted as the Nazis may have been, the US haven't exactly been saints over the years. Then there's the Afghanistan and Iraq invasions (the Brits are no better). Bin Laden, Gaddafi, Hitler and Hussein may have been exceptions, but look how things turned out for them.
 
Was it really necessary though?! I thought the Japs were broke and close to surrender. The US at the time saw their entire population as vermin and were ready to drop even more bombs on them. The point is, as twisted as the Nazis may have been, the US haven't exactly been saints over the years. Then there's the Afghanistan and Iraq invasions (the Brits are no better). Bin Laden, Gaddafi, Hitler and Hussein may have been exceptions, but look how things turned out for them.

The US estimated casualties in the millions for the invasion of Japan, the US is still giving out purple hearts ordered during WWII because we ordered so many of them in preparation. The 2 atomic bombs could actually be considered more humane than invading.
 
Hey Dresden... How about you and me go head to head on this topic...

What the world would be like today had they won.

Kind of surprised this thread has managed to survive this long without completely devolving into a mess...

I'm interested in both of your thoughts on what the world would look like. I know talking about hypothetical situations is almost as pointless as this debate but this has sparked my curiosity.

Also curious to know if Dresden's worldview about Jews is 100% or are there exceptions -- (eg would he hang out do shots at an affiliate summit w/ Jon despite his heritage)