AMA JON FISHER - ASK ME ANYTHING
- Thread starter Jon
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Remember that discussion over the phone we had what seems to be 10 years ago about healthygo? I know this guy now, supposedly worth 100M, I think we can make this happen.
In all seriousness, about the whole adderall thing. I've never tried it, but I've been thinking about it (wife nags the shit out of me NOT to and "just do it"), but FUCK; I guess the real problem is, I don't particularly like doing what I do anymore, but it's what I'm best at. Is this a question? Not really, just some feels.
In all seriousness, about the whole adderall thing. I've never tried it, but I've been thinking about it (wife nags the shit out of me NOT to and "just do it"), but FUCK; I guess the real problem is, I don't particularly like doing what I do anymore, but it's what I'm best at. Is this a question? Not really, just some feels.
Thanks for giving it an easier title. I'll try that one out and see how it goes.
I don't scale the way you're thinking I do. What I run, firm/consulting wise, is VERY different from the norm. If it weren't just me at the helm then I bet I could run it like any other firm and list out services and pricing and all of that stuff.
But what I do is unique. See, every "gig" or "campaign" that I'm commissioned for, if I choose to take it on or not (I've rejected plenty, sometimes its just too bat shit crazy for even me to take on, regardless of how much is being offered!), is 100% unique for that specific client.
Think one use only.
I keep it very simple. The potential client gives me a goal they want to achieve from this campaign. A simple end result goal. If they want to add lil details and notes, by all means, they can do so but on a different page.
See, in order to accomplish the mission, so the client gets to the goal portion, you need to keep that absolutely fucking simple as humanly possible. Otherwise things get complicated, quickly. And you do not want that to fuck shit up for you, because it will.
Now, by campaign or gig, I'm not referring to an advertising campaign or how to sell this or that.. its almost always something of a much higher caliber in a realm not often associated with what you may be used to seeing.
So here is an example based off of a real world client with a real goal campaign that I helped them achieve:
The client is a defense contractor that happens to be a manufacturer of high grade armor piercing bullets. These bullets are meant for combat zones, not hunting or range folk.
Their goal for this campaign is that they want everyone in the war zone region to be using their ammunition. Friend or foe, they do not care. But they can only sell to friend.
Fine. This, although it has major ethical and moral issues tied to it, I've had the lawyers sign off on it, agreeing it isn't illegal, and I am not liable nor will I run into any legal issues nor will the client, etc etc. Great.
They give me a timeline/deadline projection, realistically. But usually clients don't, they just want it done, because its something they just don't know how to ask their current PR or marketing guys to do.
So here I am, an internet guy. Wtf do I know about these bullets? Only that they do a damn good job at penetrating body armor (why someone needs that is fuckin crazy in its own right = but I don't let personal beliefs, nor ethics or morals get involved). Research shows that this bullet can be used in 90% of the small arms used in that specific region during this specific conflict.
Okay great. So we gather all sorts of other intel and data, and try to forecast how long combat will last in this region, how many of our forces and allied forces are there, at what levels, along with when we pull out, how much cash will the rebels or natives have, and will they keep trying to buy the clients' bullets (once friendlies are out of the region, its typical that the nation will be added to a "yes its okay for you to buy bullets from these corps now" list.. if not, then the client is advised against it and that they may want to reconsider their goal and position.. etc.)
Okay, so we get the green light.
So what I do is devise a whole bunch of clever ways to simultaneously work together in persuading and influencing the friendlies and allies to not only increase their orders of these wonderfully deadly bullets, but to also get them into the lore of awe in the enemies eyes, hearts and minds too. You want these bullets to go from just being regular boring but deadly bullets to becoming the JAY-Z LOOK AT ME I'M A FUCKING PIMP OF ALL PIMPS bullets.
And without going into any detail, I go about engineering a campaign that carries this out, using both online and offline tactics and radical new techniques either dreamed up by me or by some of the other very few folk that do this kinda work, without ever being there myself (sometimes it calls for it, but very rarely, and my days of wanting to be at combat zones are long over now). Also, the trick here is to do so, carry this out, without any of the friendlies or anyone else knowing that they are 1- Being persuaded 2- Being influenced. -- Its not as easy as one may think. Advertising on that level, within that small frame point, without showing anyone a single advertisement or just saying "hey, fuckhead, buy more of these now!" is tricky stuff. But its one hell of a challenge, and that's what I really enjoy most.
Once the campaign is deemed successful... EVERY SINGLE PART of that operation, from my side, is tossed out, deleted, etc. You see, to ensure absolute success for this time and the next, everything needs to be built and modeled from scratch each and every time. Sometimes things go wrong, not often, but sometimes they also exceed expectations, and when you get crazy evil requests like that, over-exceeding expectations can be bad for everyone, not just you.
Something like this would cost well into the seven-eight figure range, depending on how much the client stands to profit and other variables like time, and effort, sensitivity, factors that make zero sense to anyone but the client, etc.mark. For services rendered. Not including budget and all sorts of other wonderfully complex fees that always add up quickly.
So yeah.. this is an area I really like and I also REALLY think I was meant to focus on. Unfortunately, it takes a long time to build up, and I have to put a lot of effort into it, myself. I have yet to meet someone else that can handle this for me or with me. There are a few others that dabble in this, but they
Note: This was merely an example. I have provided services similar to this to a defense contracting firm in a combat zone, but they weren't selling anything. It was way tougher than this. But it worked out wonderfully for them!
So yeah... how should I scale my operations for Client Services on this one?
PS- Anyone from the internet marketing industry that doesn't think they can use what they've learned in this industry and apply it to others, is an imbecile. I'm certainly not inviting you to play with me in this realm, but don't be so obtuse on the topic, its annoying.
I am a man of principles. I have these principles, and I must stick to them. I don't fuck with the principles. In fact, I've tried, and it doesn't work out for me. So I don't defy it.
Everything else is kinda fair game and at my discretion. But I sure as hell try to do things fairly from the start. I'm not about the greed factor, more so about the quality and high performance, less headaches, more profit, you know, keep it simple, keep everyone buzzing in harmony. Less issues the better. More profit the better, but within reason too.
I've had biz partners and peers that have thrown away some of the best product deals ever, all because they want to add $3 more to their profit margin, on a patented product. It boggles my mind sometimes what people do or the decisions they make just to save a few bucks. So if that's what they will do, I don't stand in their way. I may share my opinion, but I've learned to just stay the fuck out of trying to help them not kill themselves. If they want help, they will call out for it. So long as it doesn't fuck with my profits, then I try to stay the hell out of their way.
Gotta compromise. Can't save the world. That's how it works.
Honestly, I hope anyone with that kind of technology does not trust me with it. Because after altering a few serious things, I'd go on a fucking rampage of lulz with it, and upon returning to now, all humans would be decimated, except for me. That would really suck.
You mention partners and JV's here and there, but how much of your success would you say comes from partnerships?
Also, this thread is pretty amazing.
Also, this thread is pretty amazing.
I cannot resist the urge to ask one more.
What is the biggest loss you have made in your career?
What is the biggest loss you have made in your career?
You started early when the internet was on scarcity, you took advantage of every new things that could go in and have potential for money in the online world.
Compared to today's affiliate marketers / service providers, back then, the competition was low.
How did you saw the internet today when you were in the '90s ?
My point is, since you have the experience of the past, can you speculate on what the internet/world will become in 10-20 years ? And where do you see yourself then ?
Compared to today's affiliate marketers / service providers, back then, the competition was low.
How did you saw the internet today when you were in the '90s ?
My point is, since you have the experience of the past, can you speculate on what the internet/world will become in 10-20 years ? And where do you see yourself then ?
Jon, amazing stuff. Time to use my quarter in the jukebox!
It seems you've been around about as long as it's been here, the web.
As I'm approaching 30, solid income nothing I can brag about, I'm beginning to wander from the web into more personal paths, and, I'm concerned whether or not I can make websites and work with small businesses forever.
My question is do you know guys similar to me, who work with SMB's and small-medium projects living well, end up retiring happily, or do they eventually turn towards more responsibility for profit because of the lack of that longevity?
It seems you've been around about as long as it's been here, the web.
As I'm approaching 30, solid income nothing I can brag about, I'm beginning to wander from the web into more personal paths, and, I'm concerned whether or not I can make websites and work with small businesses forever.
My question is do you know guys similar to me, who work with SMB's and small-medium projects living well, end up retiring happily, or do they eventually turn towards more responsibility for profit because of the lack of that longevity?
I never mentioned JV's, because I hate that term, and it looks like Junior Varsity to me, and why anyone would think partnering with some freshman high school kid is a good idea now, is beyond me.
As for partnerships in business. I always try to have a partner. Always.
There are areas in business and operations alike, that I am fucking horrible at. So horrible, that I know for a fact it would do more harm than good if I tried to ignore it and go at it alone. No way.
I like operations that work. I like team operations even more. Three partners, up to four is the limit. I had a fiveway once, but it failed pretty miserably, so I shy away from them now. But doubles and triples are okay. Doubles are the best.
Again, I'm not this overly greedy bastard that requires ALL PROFITS ARE BELONG TO ME, but I do expect them to carry their load and then some. Just the way I do.
Partnerships are typically great too because when both people are working for the TEAM and not for one another, things go down a lot smoother, and you tend to make way more money. ESPECIALLY when you don't need to babysit each other. Sometimes, you need to kick some ass, but its best to do so with respect and as an adult. Don't be a fuckin pussy about it, but don't be a douche either, because that can poison the well, very quickly. And no one wants that. I dunno, I try not to do an partnerships with people I know TOO well or not at all.
I've done partnerships in business with people I've never met before or met only a handful of times and saw they were on point.... (and of course pending the final report on their in-depth background check and psychological profile.. No one wants to go into biz with a psycho, after all. )
I don't speculate in those areas that far in advance. You can't. No one can. The internet is so misunderstood as a whole, and beyond chaotic. No one can predict accurately anyway, so if you're doing it as a bullshit blog piece, fine, knock yourself out, look like the magical expert and such.. but realistically... not possible... Don't even attempt it, you'll drive yourself fucking crazy.
My net worth is none of anyone's concern. Nor is my personal net worth $100M. Quit saying that. Enough of this out of context bullshit.
As far as anyone is concerned, my fortune is made up of jellybeans. Now fuck off.
As far as anyone is concerned, my fortune is made up of jellybeans. Now fuck off.
Wow..
Cool thread.
Weird how I have been here from (almost) the beginning.
The Chris Lingle thing.. I don't even know where I was, being busy and the time zone difference... like all big WF dramas.. I only learned about it afterwards.
So no question from me (just PM me those niches you promised, kthnx)..
Just a big thank you for keeping WF alive.
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Cool thread.
Weird how I have been here from (almost) the beginning.
The Chris Lingle thing.. I don't even know where I was, being busy and the time zone difference... like all big WF dramas.. I only learned about it afterwards.
So no question from me (just PM me those niches you promised, kthnx)..
Just a big thank you for keeping WF alive.
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I've got to absolutely second this. The people that I've met, my experiences, other peoples experiences, and perspective from like minded people from different cultures all over the world has had a tremendous impact on myself and my own perceptions of the world and my day to day life and just an overall positive impact on me as a person. Wickedfire had made that all possible, so thanks Jon and everyone else.
I'm still just a pesky little faggot that rides the cash grab waves here and there, but this place has definitely influenced me for the better and will always serve as a value resource and ultimately something that changed my life, I'm sure others could say the same. /end cock ride
What is the most commonly recurring bad decision(s) you've seen in business dealings that you've been apart of?
My company took a $3.3M loss on a Facebook campaign. We owned I think, 80% of the inventory via Microsoft, the top banner display for Facebook Canada, back in.. 2009 (I'm pretty sure). We just didn't have enough campaigns to fill the thing and be profitable. But it was worth the loss, because we stopped all of our competitors from taking any sizable share, and it ultimately scored us major credit with other agencies.
I've taken some losses through out the years. Nothing massive. But the dumbest one I made, was with Adwords, left something running when I shouldn't have, came back the next day, had racked up a $70k'ish bill. Gotta love those finance keywords. Worst part, they all went to a dead/empty page. So that definitely sucked.
But losses can be minimized if you really want them to be.
For any project I take on, I give it a strict, 90-day (very rarely, but now I sometimes extend it to 120-days) profit or not policy. Meaning, from day one of starting business, we have 90-days to hit profit, otherwise I'm out. It has saved my ass many times form being bogged down or getting too invested, but a few times it did make me think maybe I was being too tough on people, but not enough to make me stop. Everyone is different. I don't set expectations or projections unless I am damn sure I can meet it or better, surpass them.
But I've certainly exited way more companies and projects than I've started with. To each their own.