Eric Holder's Message To U.S. Citizens...

[music4mic]

It would kind of depend on the situation. If the CIA via wiretaps hears Billy Bob conspiring with known terrorists on a plot to blow up a mall in 2 hours, and then sees him walking into a mall with a stuffed backpack...yeah snipe the fucker. Or do you let him walk in the mall and blow people up? Or do you try to arrest him and get cops blown up?

And the more important question, is this actually happening?

The US gov't scribbles so much bullshit into law that the entire constitution is fucked, there's no use in getting worked up about more scribbles. Get worked up when they actually start assassinating innocent US civilians like flies...but that's not happening.

I see your point, but just using your example, if they know the guy is a threat then they have the opportunity to arrest him and bring him to justice. Assuming the wiretaps are legal, if they know he's going to blow up a mall they probably have enough evidence to lock him up for life.

The problem with your logic is that if and when they start assassinating innocent civilians like flies:

a) they will have another excuse and people won't care, because it's not them.

b) it will be far too late to go back and try and do anything to stop it.


You take an apathetic approach to the whole thing and that's wrong. That's the reason there are so many scribbles on the constitution.

 

[SUP3RNOVA]

I see your point, but just using your example, if they know the guy is a threat then they have the opportunity to arrest him and bring him to justice. Assuming the wiretaps are legal, if they know he's going to blow up a mall they probably have enough evidence to lock him up for life.

Perhaps the guy was communicating this as he was heading out to his car to drive to the mall, or just before. By the time the feds get to him at the EARLIEST he'll be driving in his car with explosives. Any attempt to arrest him would be risking the lives of any cops involved, as he'd likely use the explosives against them. So I guess maybe they could shoot a tranquilizer dart at his neck instead of a bullet, but there are certain situations that simply cannot warrant somebody "due process".

The problem with your logic is that if and when they start assassinating innocent civilians like flies:

Well, they wont. but

a) they will have another excuse and people won't care, because it's not them.

If the gov't starts executing tens/hundreds of innocent civilians on US soil, I'm pretty sure you'll have revolutionary groups forming to stop it.

b) it will be far too late to go back and try and do anything to stop it.

Yeah I think a situation like that is unrealistic. The US starts executing civilians like flies, revolutionary groups form to fight it, but it's too late and the government starts killing off the revo groups, and next think you know we're the Communist States of America. You MIGHT see that plot line in the next few years, in a movie theatre starring Brad Pitt.

You take an apathetic approach to the whole thing and that's wrong. That's the reason there are so many scribbles on the constitution.

No, the reason there are so many scribbles on the constitution is because shady political figures lied, duped, and paid people into voting for them, creating a system full of greedy and shady liars. Not because I'm apathetic to a certain scribble.

 

[turbolapp]

I know you're just trolling, but

It's fallacy to assume this. We all grew up waving the flag and the rehetoric that this was the freest country in the world with liberty and justice for all it's citizens.

Unfortunately, this makes it all the more difficult to make people see and that much easier for the government to abuse it's power.

 

[lukep]

Drone? You could go to any mall in America and fish out a rent-a-cop to haul in the most vicious of Anonymous.

OWS leadership would probably take a few standard issue cops.

Don't be silly. Anonymous has grown in power by leaps and bounds... They've taken a major US security site down every week for months now on their #FuckFBIFridays and no one has touched them yet. (Just lulzsec, because 1 dude got sloppy and was turned.)

#Occupy, too, has been such a problem that Obama signed that godawful tresspass bill into law a few days ago! (The one that makes it illegal to protest in public whenever they inform you that you can't anymore.)

Rentacop fodder my arse. They're causing CHANGE... You know, like obama promised.

If I wanted to leave where would I go? The American governments arm is far reaching. Short of North Korea or China where would I go?

It's more about not being here where the arm can indiscriminately smack you. I'm not moving to BKK because I think uncle sam is going to start literally torturing all americans with a whip or something... I think the dollar is going to get inflated, goods will start losing their quality, internet will be more and more monitored, laws will become more and more strict until you can't do anything anymore that doesn't give money to a sponsor corporation or bank, incarcerations will keep going up, freedoms overall will keep going down.

ANYWHERE BUT HERE is the answer to your question. Perhaps not North Korea yet.

Also it's not that scary over here yet. I have yet to see one black van abduct my neighbors.

But the dollar is inflating, the laws are tightening rapidly like a noose around your neck, the internet is a smaller place, protesters can now legally be told to stop protesting or go to jail immediately, we're about to go into another illegal war that the people clearly do not want, and today it's perfectly A-OK for the potus to put a hit on you for whatever reason he can come up with at the time... This was not the case just a few short months ago. Remember?

The US gov't scribbles so much bullshit into law that the entire constitution is fucked, there's no use in getting worked up about more scribbles. Get worked up when they actually start assassinating innocent US civilians like flies...but that's not happening.

You're clearly drawing the line in the wrong place. It's like you don't have any clue what the constitution was for...

WE THE PEOPLE only have our constitution to keep evils like those you mentioned from happening. That's it. You don't have another route to stopping them. If you lose the paperwork battle in congress, do you think they'll let you pick up a gun and win some "other battle?"

Get your head out of your ass and look what people like YOU have done with your apathy.

 

[music4mic]

Unfortunately, this makes it all the more difficult to make people see and that much easier for the government to abuse it's power.

I agree with you, we were pretty much taught we're too great to fail which is extremely dangerous. I was more referencing the fact that SUP3RNOVA tends to come into these types threads looking for an argument though. I have no doubt that he believes every word he says.

Perhaps the guy was communicating this as he was heading out to his car to drive to the mall, or just before. By the time the feds get to him at the EARLIEST he'll be driving in his car with explosives. Any attempt to arrest him would be risking the lives of any cops involved, as he'd likely use the explosives against them. So I guess maybe they could shoot a tranquilizer dart at his neck instead of a bullet, but there are certain situations that simply cannot warrant somebody "due process".

If this is the case, law enforcement already has the authority to use lethal force, it doesn't require authorization from the president. I think the law says something to the effect of "lethal force to be used when there is clear and imminent danger." What we're talking about above isn't that.

Well, they wont. but
If the gov't starts executing tens/hundreds of innocent civilians on US soil, I'm pretty sure you'll have revolutionary groups forming to stop it.

One would hope, but this wouldn't be the first time in history that this has happened. Power hungry governments love deleting their peasants and over the centuries they've become extremely efficient at it.

Yeah I think a situation like that is unrealistic. The US starts executing civilians like flies, revolutionary groups form to fight it, but it's too late and the government starts killing off the revo groups, and next think you know we're the Communist States of America. You MIGHT see that plot line in the next few years, in a movie theatre starring Brad Pitt.

I certainly hope you're right and I'm wrong, but red flags are waving all over the place dude. You can choose to ignore (or deny) them, I honestly wish I could ignore them.

No, the reason there are so many scribbles on the constitution is because shady political figures lied, duped, and paid people into voting for them, creating a system full of greedy and shady liars. Not because I'm apathetic to a certain scribble.

You're half right. It's a combination of both- shady politicians do horrendous things, then Americans don't hold them responsible (that's the apathy part.)

 

[SUP3RNOVA]

I was more referencing the fact that SUP3RNOVA tends to come into these types threads looking for an argument though.

Because the WF/reddit/internet crowd loves getting all up in arms about these types of things, and they're usually overly dramatic. So many people use the words "scary", "tyranny", "treason", "no freedom", and all they do is bitch about it on the internet. This annoys me and encourages me to retaliate with equal bitchiness on the internet.

We've got a horrible foreign policy, horrible welfare system, and a President that likes stretching his powers a bit. A lot of room for improvement, but fucks sakes America isn't as bad as the internet makes it out to be. With all the bitching I've heard in the past 5 years you'd be almost certain by now that we'd be living in martial law. Whoops.

If this is the case, law enforcement already has the authority to use lethal force, it doesn't require authorization from the president. I think the law says something to the effect of "lethal force to be used when there is clear and imminent danger." What we're talking about above isn't that.

What are we talking about? Are there any real world examples of this being done to US citizens on US soil?

It seems to me that we're just fearing imaginary situations.

I certainly hope you're right and I'm wrong, but red flags are waving all over the place dude. You can choose to ignore (or deny) them, I honestly wish I could ignore them.

I'm neither ignoring or denying the "red flags". But there's really nothing we can do about what the government writes into law. We can wait for the politicians to die and then hopefully elect honest people into office, or we can revolt and burn down DC.

You're half right. It's a combination of both- shady politicians do horrendous things, then Americans don't hold them responsible (that's the apathy part.)

How exactly can I hold them responsible? Talk about it on the internet? Go to Wall St and stand outside protesting? Because both of those methods are clearly ineffective.

I did change my mind about my voting stance and acknowledge that voting for the independent isn't useless if people actually do it. So I can vote, but that's one of the very limited ways I can "hold them responsible".

 

[SUP3RNOVA]

Get your head out of your ass and look what people like YOU have done with your apathy.

What exactly have I done? Did I vote any of the corrupt politicians into office? No. Do I tell my friends that we should encourage more bills like these? No.

What have YOU done to fight this?

 

[cheshire]

It's more about not being here where the arm can indiscriminately smack you. I'm not moving to BKK because I think uncle sam is going to start literally torturing all americans with a whip or something... I think the dollar is going to get inflated, goods will start losing their quality, internet will be more and more monitored, laws will become more and more strict until you can't do anything anymore that doesn't give money to a sponsor corporation or bank, incarcerations will keep going up, freedoms overall will keep going down.

ANYWHERE BUT HERE is the answer to your question. Perhaps not North Korea yet.

So if America really wanted you they couldn't just send a team in to extract you from BKK? Is the Government in BKK better than the US? inb4 LukeP is tortured in a Bangkok prison for speaking out against their Government.

But the dollar is inflating,

I suppose the dollar is inflating, but it's not anywhere close to the highest inflation we've had. And it's pretty much on par with the Euro

http://inflationdata.com/Inflation/Inflation_Rate/HistoricalInflation.aspx

Euro Area Inflation Rate

the laws are tightening rapidly like a noose around your neck,

Congress has passed literally thousands of laws since I was born and not much has changed in my life. Laws are only effective if they can enforce them.

the internet is a smaller place, protesters can now legally be told to stop protesting or go to jail immediately,

I don't see a bunch of hippies in a city park beating drums and spewing rhetoric as "protesters." Hippies have been doing this shit for many decades now. Real protesters do stuff other than obstruct public parks with their drum circles. Take a look at the African Americans protests during the civil rights movement. They took the streets with pitchforks, sticks, and knives to end true oppression. When is the last time you went out and protested in the streets?

we're about to go into another illegal war that the people clearly do not want,

What war? Iran? I'm pretty sure that'd be political suicide for any government official right now.

and today it's perfectly A-OK for the potus to put a hit on you for whatever reason he can come up with at the time... This was not the case just a few short months ago. Remember?

Or was it? Maybe they just didn't air the fact that they will kill anyone deemed a terrorist. The U.S. Government has always had a shoot first ask questions later attitude towards terrorists/ national security. I'm fairly certain that prior to 2001 if I was responsible for terrorist activity and had the blood of thousands of Americans on my hands I'd be taken out. You're just more aware of it thanks to the constant barrage of media.

With all that said I don't like what is going on in this country either. And frankly I'm pissed that someone like you would just throw their hands up and walk away to a place like Bangkok. With all due respect you're a pussy for just walking away and a chicken shit for being scared. You're just going to give up the country that your ancestors fought with blood, sweat and tears to create. America needs people like you right now, leaders who see shit for what it is, more than any other time in history.

So go ahead Luke, hoard your gold and hole up somewhere in a 3rd world shit hole, just don't expect any sympathy from me when they come drag your ass out of your cave and shoot you in the street, when you could've just made your stand here and fought for what you believe in.

 

[guerilla]

I'm done with that way of thinking: I'Z SEEN TEH LITE.

Hallelujah and Hosanna.

lol wow are you people really surprised by this? if any government in the world wants you dead, you're dead. Some piece of paper isn't going to protect you if they want to kill you.

Now for eric holder to come out and say that in public isn't the smartest idea, but it doesn't change the fact that if the government wants you dead, you're fucked.

This guy gets it.

The truth ain't pretty, but I still believe it is better than living out a bunch of delusions. You don't have rights, and the government isn't your friend. The sooner people realize this, the sooner they can take measures to protect themselves and the people they love.

 

[music4mic]

Because the WF/reddit/internet crowd loves getting all up in arms about these types of things, and they're usually overly dramatic. So many people use the words "scary", "tyranny", "treason", "no freedom", and all they do is bitch about it on the internet. This annoys me and encourages me to retaliate with equal bitchiness on the internet.

Yea, I mean I don't think you're bad guy or a retard, I just think you troll and you follow some bad information. Nothing wrong with the trolling though and I don't blame you for listening to your TV. We've been trained to do that, some of us just see the bigger picture.

We've got a horrible foreign policy, horrible welfare system, and a President that likes stretching his powers a bit.

agree, agree, wait wut? We have lots of presidents that break the law (or bend it to their own needs) and it's getting worse. That's why so many of are up in arms.

With all the bitching I've heard in the past 5 years you'd be almost certain by now that we'd be living in martial law. Whoops.

If we follow Jefferson's definition of tyranny we made it there a long time ago. Ummm, their trying to give the prez the power to do that, did you read NDAA? Red flag dude.

What are we talking about? Are there any real world examples of this being done to US citizens on US soil?

It seems to me that we're just fearing imaginary situations.

What's the question, are there instances where law enforcement stops a crime before it happens with deadly force? Well important thing to remember is that cops don't normally prevent crimes, they catch and charge those guilty of crimes. However, in our imaginary situation above, cops would have the ability to use legal force if necessary. In the OP, they are referencing the presidents ability to assassinate someone even if they don't necessarily represent a clear and imminent threat. That's the difference.

I'm neither ignoring or denying the "red flags". But there's really nothing we can do about what the government writes into law. We can wait for the politicians to die and then hopefully elect honest people into office, or we can revolt and burn down DC.

O RLY? If you pester congress enough they do act. If they think an issue might cost them to lose their job, they act. This idea that you can't do anything is absurd.

How exactly can I hold them responsible? Talk about it on the internet? Go to Wall St and stand outside protesting? Because both of those methods are clearly ineffective.

There are plenty of groups that focus on this. I've been part of a group that got an house rep. incumbent of 1X years thrown out office in exchange for a much better one, and got many liberty friendly local and state men/women elected. Oh and protesting works if you actually have a cause, unlike the OWS guys. Talking about it on the internet isn't bad for raising awareness, but you do have to get off your ass and act, or at least contribute financially.

I did change my mind about my voting stance and acknowledge that voting for the independent isn't useless if people actually do it. So I can vote, but that's one of the very limited ways I can "hold them responsible".

That's a start for sure. I think the biggest problem people have is that they participate and don't see instant results so they give up. We've had a century of bad people trying to do some very bad things in this country and undoing the damage they've done isn't going to happen over night. But conversation is probably the most important part of changing things. You've got to know what the problem is before you can try and solve it.

 

[TheBrozar]

Ron Paul bitch slaps Eric Holder and Ben Bernanke everyday before breakfast with the constitution.

 

[negro2k]

all you haters just mad that we brothas are now in power what do you expect a black man to say after over 100 years of oppression shit if i became president i would be saying the same shit

 

[music4mic]

all you haters just mad that we brothas are now in power what do you expect a black man to say after over 100 years of oppression shit if i became president i would be saying the same shit

He's only half black and I'd like to think that the white half is still oppressing the black half.

 

[lukep]

What exactly have I done? Did I vote any of the corrupt politicians into office? No. Do I tell my friends that we should encourage more bills like these? No.

What have YOU done to fight this?

You were apathetic, which was my whole point. I was not, I'm trying to be a voice of reason and spread truth. There is strength in numbers and you're not enlarging those numbers.

Further, I supported RP in many ways. I don't remember if you did too so if so, then I'll rescind my full accusation and just remind you that apathy hurts the cause the Doc is fighting so hard for.

So if America really wanted you they couldn't just send a team in to extract you from BKK? Is the Government in BKK better than the US? inb4 LukeP is tortured in a Bangkok prison for speaking out against their Government.

Still not the point. I am not one who is scared of seal team 6 sniping me late at night. Obomba, true to his name, has bigger fish to fry than little old me, especially when people like me make up the MINORITY of this country that pays its' taxes. Obomba NEEDS me here to pay my taxes so he can go kill brown people. (Oh the irony.) I don't wish to help him with that.

I suppose the dollar is inflating, but it's not anywhere close to the highest inflation we've had. And it's pretty much on par with the Euro

USD vs EURO? LULZ...

That comparison means Dicksauce. It means that the EU economy is stuck on the same sinking ship.

Here's the comparison that RP and I care about:

Gold has been the default currency of this planet for almost 6 thousand years... Until Nixon put the world on the USD as the default currency, but that is all crumbling rapidly now. Most of Asia cares more about the RMB than it does the USD now, and that is doing great since china owns most of our debt.

Face it, the dollar can't keep going the direction it is in now without some type of hyperinflation/crash scenario. It was way too artificially held aloft for way too long. The crash is going to be BAD.

Congress has passed literally thousands of laws since I was born and not much has changed in my life. Laws are only effective if they can enforce them.

They can enforce them though.

The nature of this government has been proven to be one where they turn the temperature up on the pot slowly but surely. In time we'll be boiled because they simply keep passing laws and giving themselves more power.

First Obomba passes NDAA saying "I wouldn't use it though."

Then he uses it on Alwaki in Yemin, saying "Yeah but he was a real threat to us!"

Then he uses it on Alwaki's 16 year old son saying "Yeah but he is going to be a threat to us one day."

Next he'll use it on someone who is a "Potential threat..."

After that he'll use it on someone who is a "Dissident..."

And after that he'll be using it on large numbers of "Dissidents..."

And then he'll be using it in places like OWS protests on large numbers of "Dissidents..."

...All of which is ALREADY LEGAL. He can enforce this all NOW.

Between each level there is a national period of adjustment which the media makes all the sheeple feel OK about. It won't even register as a bad thing to people who aren't watching out for it, just like Alwaki's death doesn't register as a bad thing to 99% of this stupid-ass country.

I don't see a bunch of hippies in a city park beating drums and spewing rhetoric as "protesters." Hippies have been doing this shit for many decades now. Real protesters do stuff other than obstruct public parks with their drum circles. Take a look at the African Americans protests during the civil rights movement. They took the streets with pitchforks, sticks, and knives to end true oppression. When is the last time you went out and protested in the streets?

The fact that you belittle them so much speaks VOLUMES about how much you believe the MSM's reporting of them.

Can you prove that all of #Occupy, or even the majority of #Occupy is just harmless, drum-beating hippies?

From the videos I've seen they keep getting more and more organized, more and more powerful, which is evidenced as Obomba signing in the tresspass law the other day specifically to target them.

What war? Iran? I'm pretty sure that'd be political suicide for any government official right now.

Oh, so that's the reason why Mitt, Newt, Obomba, and Frothy are all campaigning to "stop them from having a nuke at all?" Because it's political suicide? PLEASE.

In this stupid-ass country, the ONLY people who don't want a war are all Paul supporters. These sheeple just don't want to call it a war, but they want it.

Or was it? Maybe they just didn't air the fact that they will kill anyone deemed a terrorist. The U.S. Government has always had a shoot first ask questions later attitude towards terrorists/ national security. I'm fairly certain that prior to 2001 if I was responsible for terrorist activity and had the blood of thousands of Americans on my hands I'd be taken out. You're just more aware of it thanks to the constant barrage of media.

NDAA was clearly a step or two beyond. They had to catch the "terrorist" in the act before, and if they caught them alive they had to give them a trial to make sure he's guilty. Not anymore. Now they can afford to be indiscriminant. Bombs away!

With all that said I don't like what is going on in this country either. And frankly I'm pissed that someone like you would just throw their hands up and walk away to a place like Bangkok. With all due respect you're a pussy for just walking away and a chicken shit for being scared. You're just going to give up the country that your ancestors fought with blood, sweat and tears to create. America needs people like you right now, leaders who see shit for what it is, more than any other time in history.

So go ahead Luke, hoard your gold and hole up somewhere in a 3rd world shit hole, just don't expect any sympathy from me when they come drag your ass out of your cave and shoot you in the street, when you could've just made your stand here and fought for what you believe in.

You'd have a point here if I believed that this is about hiding from a violent aggressor that wants me dead. It's not. The day is not likely to come where men in black would hunt me down, either here or in thailand.

It's about the lowered quality of life here. It's going to get worse and worse and worse.

If any amount of campaigning or internet hyjinks could save us from the dollar crash, the lowered freedoms, or the other things that are going to lower the quality of every american's life, I'd partake, like I tried to with RP. But the system is too strong and too dead-set on destroying the constitution along with anyone else that stands in the corporation's way. (And in the petrodollar's way, of course.)

It's not going to be a fight anyone here can win. Even if a violent fight broke out, consider this:

In the 1770's, about 12% of colonists decided to take up arms while the rest of the colonists were either scared, too busy surviving, or loyal to Briton. Back then it was gun against gun and the colonists had the homefield advantage, only having to get the brits off their soil to win.

Today it is a smaller percentage than 12% that have looked up from american idol long enough to notice they're not so free anymore. I don't know the number but I'd guess ~5%.

Then there is no gun v/s gun equality. If we brought shotguns and even AK-47s, they'd use high-altitude drones and a legion of Abrams M1 tanks on us. Fuck that.

Worse yet, there is no longer a homefield advantage. The CSA found that out the hard way. The bad guys could just keep fucking coming, nonstop.

To make a violent revolution work in the USA you're going to need two things: Sympathy from the Military, and far, far, far more numbers of the enlightened. Perhaps 50% or more.

Good luck with that.

So don't talk to me about how running to another country is bad... Pack your fucking bags or suffer. Those are your choices. Get used to it.

 

[lukep]

This guy gets it.

Shit G, you don't know what you've just encouraged! :stop:

 

[cheshire]

Still not the point. I am not one who is scared of seal team 6 sniping me late at night. Obomba, true to his name, has bigger fish to fry than little old me, especially when people like me make up the MINORITY of this country that pays its' taxes. Obomba NEEDS me here to pay my taxes so he can go kill brown people. (Oh the irony.) I don't wish to help him with that.

Then why are you leaving to go to a more unstable part of the world? You won't win any battles there either.

USD vs EURO? LULZ...

That comparison means Dicksauce. It means that the EU economy is stuck on the same sinking ship.

Here's the comparison that RP and I care about:

Gold has been the default currency of this planet for almost 6 thousand years... Until Nixon put the world on the USD as the default currency, but that is all crumbling rapidly now. Most of Asia cares more about the RMB than it does the USD now, and that is doing great since china owns most of our debt.

But it's not the default currency anymore. China is in the shit just as much as we are. If we default they lose too.

Face it, the dollar can't keep going the direction it is in now without some type of hyperinflation/crash scenario. It was way too artificially held aloft for way too long. The crash is going to be BAD.

So you've just said above that the current system is unsustainable and will crumble under it's own weight.

They can enforce them though.

The nature of this government has been proven to be one where they turn the temperature up on the pot slowly but surely. In time we'll be boiled because they simply keep passing laws and giving themselves more power.

But here you say that the Government is all reaching with unlimited resources? If the system crumbles where do the tax dollars for killing brown people come from again?

First Obomba passes NDAA saying "I wouldn't use it though."

Then he uses it on Alwaki in Yemin, saying "Yeah but he was a real threat to us!"

Threats to national security have always been dealt with swiftly and without prejudice for race, religion, or citizenship.

Then he uses it on Alwaki's 16 year old son saying "Yeah but he is going to be a threat to us one day."

If he was involved in his fathers "business" he is a target and a threat to national security. His age has nothing to do with it.

Next he'll use it on someone who is a "Potential threat..."

After that he'll use it on someone who is a "Dissident..."

And after that he'll be using it on large numbers of "Dissidents..."

And then he'll be using it in places like OWS protests on large numbers of "Dissidents..."

...All of which is ALREADY LEGAL. He can enforce this all NOW.

You don't think people will be up in arms when the U.S. Government starts shooting their children in the parks and streets? People don't give a shit right now because it doesn't directly affect their lives. When a President turns the Military on protestors I may agree with you. Hopefully it'll never go there.

Between each level there is a national period of adjustment which the media makes all the sheeple feel OK about. It won't even register as a bad thing to people who aren't watching out for it, just like Alwaki's death doesn't register as a bad thing to 99% of this stupid-ass country.

People rarely get upset when you kill a murderer. It's natural.

The fact that you belittle them so much speaks VOLUMES about how much you believe the MSM's reporting of them.

Can you prove that all of #Occupy, or even the majority of #Occupy is just harmless, drum-beating hippies?

From the videos I've seen they keep getting more and more organized, more and more powerful, which is evidenced as Obomba signing in the tresspass law the other day specifically to target them.

I'm just basing that off media reports and actually going to the occupy camp in my city. As far as I could tell it was the same hippie liberal fucks I went to school with crying about how life is hard, and how the man is keeping them down. Did I interview each and every one of them? No, I didn't.

Oh, so that's the reason why Mitt, Newt, Obomba, and Frothy are all campaigning to "stop them from having a nuke at all?" Because it's political suicide? PLEASE.

In this stupid-ass country, the ONLY people who don't want a war are all Paul supporters. These sheeple just don't want to call it a war, but they want it.

How many people have you talked with on the subject? Other than your close, politically aligned friends? No one I talk to wants to get into another bloody war with some foreign country. Just because a Politician spews some shit at a podium as a "selling point" for his campaign doesn't mean people agree with it.

NDAA was clearly a step or two beyond. They had to catch the "terrorist" in the act before, and if they caught them alive they had to give them a trial to make sure he's guilty. Not anymore. Now they can afford to be indiscriminant. Bombs away!

How many lives would you sacrifice to give a well known, and public terrorist and national security threat a trial? 10 soldiers? 20 soldiers? 100 soldiers? How many American lives do we give up so that this guy can have a trial where they will find him guilty and kill him anyway?

You'd have a point here if I believed that this is about hiding from a violent aggressor that wants me dead. It's not. The day is not likely to come where men in black would hunt me down, either here or in thailand.

It's about the lowered quality of life here. It's going to get worse and worse and worse.

If any amount of campaigning or internet hyjinks could save us from the dollar crash, the lowered freedoms, or the other things that are going to lower the quality of every american's life, I'd partake, like I tried to with RP. But the system is too strong and too dead-set on destroying the constitution along with anyone else that stands in the corporation's way. (And in the petrodollar's way, of course.)

You think if the dollar crashes that BKK is going to give you a better quality of life? I'm certain the dollar and the euro crashing is going to catastrophic and there will be nowhere safe in the world.

It's not going to be a fight anyone here can win. Even if a violent fight broke out, consider this:

In the 1770's, about 12% of colonists decided to take up arms while the rest of the colonists were either scared, too busy surviving, or loyal to Briton. Back then it was gun against gun and the colonists had the homefield advantage, only having to get the brits off their soil to win.

Today it is a smaller percentage than 12% that have looked up from american idol long enough to notice they're not so free anymore. I don't know the number but I'd guess ~5%.

Things were much worse in 1770 I can imagine. The King was a tyrant. I believe that when the Government here because truly tyrannical like Briton was in 1770 that 5% guess you made would increase significantly. Unless of course people like you just run away and stop reminding people about whats going on.

Then there is no gun v/s gun equality. If we brought shotguns and even AK-47s, they'd use high-altitude drones and a legion of Abrams M1 tanks on us. Fuck that.

I wonder how Vietnam did it then? In 1770 I bet they were saying "If we bring muskets, they'd use cannons, and a legion of well equipped troops on us." Except they didn't say "Fuck that." They said "Fuck them."

Worse yet, there is no longer a homefield advantage. The CSA found that out the hard way. The bad guys could just keep fucking coming, nonstop.

What you're describing is an all out civil war. It wouldn't be as one-sided as you think it is. The current American military runs on money. If the current economic system dies and the country splits do you think they're gonna be dropping $30m bombs on your house? Are they going to have the cash to fly a $500k an hour drone?

To make a violent revolution work in the USA you're going to need two things: Sympathy from the Military, and far, far, far more numbers of the enlightened. Perhaps 50% or more.

Good luck with that.

You should get out more often. I have several friends and family serving their country, and none of them are happy about this shit-fest either. I'm confident that they'd take up arms to DEFEND their country. They took an oath to defend it, not an oath to defend a system of tyranny.

So don't talk to me about how running to another country is bad... Pack your fucking bags or suffer. Those are your choices. Get used to it.

This pretty much sums up everything. YOU ARE SCARED. Too scared to defend what your forefathers died for. Man I really thought you were stronger. Where there is a will there is a way. Walking away makes you just as apathetic.

 

[Unarmed Gunman]

Threats to national security have always been dealt with swiftly and without prejudice for race, religion, or citizenship.

If he was involved in his fathers "business" he is a target and a threat to national security. His age has nothing to do with it.

You don't think people will be up in arms when the U.S. Government starts shooting their children in the parks and streets? People don't give a shit right now because it doesn't directly affect their lives. When a President turns the Military on protestors I may agree with you. Hopefully it'll never go there.

People rarely get upset when you kill a murderer. It's natural.
How many lives would you sacrifice to give a well known, and public terrorist and national security threat a trial? 10 soldiers? 20 soldiers? 100 soldiers? How many American lives do we give up so that this guy can have a trial where they will find him guilty and kill him anyway?

Al-Awlaki wasn't a murderer.
Al-Awlaki never took up arms against the US.
Al-Awlaki wasn't convicted of any crimes.
Al-Awlaki was never even charged with a crime.

Al-Awlaki was assassinated because "his speech and blog postings may have incited terrorists".

He was assassinated for speech.

Then for good measure, Obama had his 16-year old son assassinated two weeks later at a barbecue.

Growing up, I always wondered how people could allow leaders like Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, etc to get away with the shit they did. I always assumed shit like that could never happen here. Yet history has taught some of you motherfuckers nothing. You will justify any action taken by the State, simply because it was taken by the State. People like you (and Sup3rnova and the rest of your kind) are the reason such brutality is able to continue in the name of the State.

 

[music4mic]

Growing up, I always wondered how people could allow leaders like Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, etc to get away with the shit they did. I always assumed shit like that could never happen here. Yet history has taught some of you motherfuckers nothing. You will justify any action taken by the State, simply because it was taken by the State. People like you (and Sup3rnova and the rest of your kind) are the reason such brutality is able to continue in the name of the State.

^ this x 8928973894389742387934

 

[lukep]

I swear I was just trolled softly by Cheshire.

Scared in this day and age means you're no longer stupid.

 

[cheshire]

Al-Awlaki wasn't a murderer.
Al-Awlaki never took up arms against the US.
Al-Awlaki wasn't convicted of any crimes.
Al-Awlaki was never even charged with a crime.

Al-Awlaki was assassinated because "his speech and blog postings may have incited terrorists".

He was assassinated for speech.

Then for good measure, Obama had his 16-year old son assassinated two weeks later at a barbecue.

Growing up, I always wondered how people could allow leaders like Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, etc to get away with the shit they did. I always assumed shit like that could never happen here. Yet history has taught some of you motherfuckers nothing. You will justify any action taken by the State, simply because it was taken by the State. People like you (and Sup3rnova and the rest of your kind) are the reason such brutality is able to continue in the name of the State.

It was just a little more than "speech."

He preached for the overthrow of the United States government and taught many terrorists including 3 of the 9/11 hijackers, the Fort Hood shooter, and the "Underwear bomber." He directly helped plan the underwear bombers attack as well. Yemini wanted him "dead or alive" for plotting to kill to foreigners. In 2009 he was promoted to "Regional Commader" for Al-Queda.

This list goes on, and on, and on since the early 90's...

So Unarmed Gunman, despite almost 20 years of evidence linking him directly to the killing of many Americans, and brainwashing young Islamic children to kill westerners, how many Americans should we sacrifice to give him a fair trial which will find him guilty anyway? Would you be willing to send your Mom, Dad, Brothers and Sisters in to capture him? What about my family? Do you care?