Free webinar about FTC compliance - Tuesday 26th, 10am PST

nickycakes said:
No. They are saying that if you have claims on your website saying there has been an independent review of the product, then you need the documentation to prove that there was an independent review. If the you are getting these claims from the advertiser, then you also need to ask the advertiser for the documentation backing it up. Pretty simple.
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@Smaxor, whats your thought on this?

To me it sounded like everything and anything you see needs to be backed up by independent research.

You also need to have that documentation the advertiser provides reviewed by legal. But I'm saying, technically legal can not know if its correct or not without acutally doing a huge study.
 


dowork said:
@Smaxor, whats your thought on this?

To me it sounded like everything and anything you see needs to be backed up by independent research.

You also need to have that documentation the advertiser provides reviewed by legal. But I'm saying, technically legal can not know if its correct or not without acutally doing a huge study.
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Im tired and hungover from the long weekend...but this is what it sounded like to me as well. I left with the impression that any results, claims that are used on your site have to be proven and backed up by research and testing you have done on your own or through third party testing.

You are essentially liable for noting any claims that are made by the actual advertiser/manufacturer.

Thus, if XXXXXX says their product can get rid of acne in 2 weeks....I could be sued for pointing that out on my site? Unless I contact them directly and get all of their information, research, and documentation proving their claims?

Did I really hear that all wrong?
 
DrewClement said:
Thus, if XXXXXX says their product can get rid of acne in 2 weeks....I could be sued for pointing that out on my site? Unless I contact them directly and get all of their information, research, and documentation proving their claims?
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Not quite. You can get sued if it's not true whether or not you got their information related to the claim is irrelevant. However if you did get the information and had it reviewed by a legal team and possibly a medical consult you could potentially pass the buck so to speak if it does turn out to not be true and they had falsified the records they gave to you.
 
I think that this webinar confirmed that people running most things that need a lander (like rebills, penny auctions, insurance) will either need to go out of business or risk being prosecuted.

There is no way that an affiliate is going to do legal checks on every product he wants to split test in.

And without false claims there is no way that you can sell acai without risking falling foul of the FTC (as the shit doesn't work and any claims therefore will be false and unsubstantiated)

This webinar did the opposite of what I think Smax wanted it to do. Instead of helping affiliates to find new ways of promoting compliantly (which would have been great) it just confirmed that there basically is not really any way of promoting compliantly unless you want to spend big bucks on legal for every offer you want to run.....or......put your trust (and money) in the hands of the advertiser :)

There is one other possible way though......

Why don't the advertisers make the landers a-la-shoemoney, biz-op type landers we have seen lately. That way they can make sure everything is totally compliant and above board and they can split test the hell out of it with all the traffic they will get. Any liability will fall on their heads though.

Then the affiliates can just concentrate on traffic and ads with everything direct linked.

I know its not ideal for everyone, but it's definitely something that can be done.
 
nickster said:
I think that this webinar confirmed that people running most things that need a lander (like rebills, penny auctions, insurance) will either need to go out of business or risk being prosecuted.

There is no way that an affiliate is going to do legal checks on every product he wants to split test in.

And without false claims there is no way that you can sell acai without risking falling foul of the FTC (as the shit doesn't work and any claims therefore will be false and unsubstantiated)

This webinar did the opposite of what I think Smax wanted it to do. Instead of helping affiliates to find new ways of promoting compliantly (which would have been great) it just confirmed that there basically is not really any way of promoting compliantly unless you want to spend big bucks on legal for every offer you want to run.....or......put your trust (and money) in the hands of the advertiser :)

There is one other possible way though......

Why don't the advertisers make the landers a-la-shoemoney, biz-op type landers we have seen lately. That way they can make sure everything is totally compliant and above board and they can split test the hell out of it with all the traffic they will get. Any liability will fall on their heads though.

Then the affiliates can just concentrate on traffic and ads with everything direct linked.

I know its not ideal for everyone, but it's definitely something that can be done.
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We have been making pages for specific advertisers for publishers to run that have been reviewed by legal and have all factual information and disclosures, conversions aren't what you would be used to but they aren't terrible either. Pages are 60-85% of what former pages did

Unfortunately until companies stop allowing uncompliant ads on their network its going to be a tough road for US affiliates who wish to be compliant.

Any pubs interested in testing our complaint pages let your AM know since they are product specific and each product has sales caps the pages cant be run by a lot of people. As you know we have to be at a higher standard than most so we have already started this vetting process over a week ago to back up and validate claims by advertisers, we have a few pages already done and being tested for skin and ecigs.

Not sure if it was a scare tactic or not but supposedly the FTC is going to file at least 3-5 more similar cases around different products relatively soon, according to our counsel.
 
Sorry, let me re-phrase that.

"Why don't the advertisers make the landers a-la-shoemoney, biz-op type landers we have seen lately. That way they can make sure everything is totally compliant and above board and they can split test the hell out of it with all the traffic they will get. Any liability will fall on their heads though.......Oh and for them not to run through Copeac"
 
DrewClement said:
Im tired and hungover from the long weekend...but this is what it sounded like to me as well. I left with the impression that any results, claims that are used on your site have to be proven and backed up by research and testing you have done on your own or through third party testing.

You are essentially liable for noting any claims that are made by the actual advertiser/manufacturer.

Thus, if XXXXXX says their product can get rid of acne in 2 weeks....I could be sued for pointing that out on my site? Unless I contact them directly and get all of their information, research, and documentation proving their claims?

Did I really hear that all wrong?
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Exactly!

How do these advertorial adnetworks get around the rules? An avg consumer will def think they are legit news sites. They don't make it clear at all they are getting compensated.

How Life Works

5 secrets to getting cheaper car insurance

I wonder if TV, radio stations, ad networks, and websites can also be held liable for not doing their research to see if the ads they distribute check out ok.

In a sense we as affiliates are just another distribution channel like all of the above. They get their cut and so do we. They should be held to the same terms.

btw I love how TV ads will show pages of unreadable terms super fast where its impossible for anyone to read them. At lease online people can read our TOS if they want.
 
u know not everyone gets caught... and people still break the rules... but if you never wanna get in trouble... you follow the rules... this is just letting u know what can happen... it might not... thats the risk you take... but saying this guy does this how does he get away with it doesnt help anything... worry about you and what you want to risk
 
mkrongel said:
We have been making pages for specific advertisers for publishers to run that have been reviewed by legal and have all factual information and disclosures, conversions aren't what you would be used to but they aren't terrible either. Pages are 60-85% of what former pages did

Unfortunately until companies stop allowing uncompliant ads on their network its going to be a tough road for US affiliates who wish to be compliant.

Any pubs interested in testing our complaint pages let your AM know since they are product specific and each product has sales caps the pages cant be run by a lot of people. As you know we have to be at a higher standard than most so we have already started this vetting process over a week ago to back up and validate claims by advertisers, we have a few pages already done and being tested for skin and ecigs.

Not sure if it was a scare tactic or not but supposedly the FTC is going to file at least 3-5 more similar cases around different products relatively soon, according to our counsel.
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Good stuff, will you also provide compliant ad creatives for the affs to use?
 
Was anything said about email rebills?

I'm still sending out acai to my weightloss list, and it's still converting.

How long till I get fucked?

Oh, and will the webinar be uploaded so those of us who missed it can see it again? Or was it a one time shot.
 
With all the political bs about cutting the budget they need to start with the FTC.

Protecting stupid people doesn't work. They will continue being stupid and getting scammed no matter what the ftc does.

There is no way in hell that the FTC could even go after all the people/sites in violation.

Even the google serps are in violation. Most stupid people don't realize that the first three results are often paid advertisements. There is a small 'ads' hidden off to the side that most never notice. This is much less disclosure of compensation than many aff landers and sites. You think the ftc would ever go after google? Hell no.

Bottom line, if the bastards want to take you down, they can always find a reason to do so. It's just like the pigs, they can always find a reason to pull your ass over and harrass your shit. Even if we did actually have a lawyer check out and research every single landing page variation it wouldn't protect us. If the ftc recieves complaints and gets a hard on for you, they will screw you regardless of what your landers say.

Affiliate summit Russia 2012?

'results will vary' is no longer acceptable. LOL

'clear and conspicuous' just like the google ads?

'reasonable consumer' hehe lolz


Thanks smaxor, it was well organized and informative. It was good to hear the bs straight from the ftc.
 
the only real long-term option is to stop working with shitty merchants who cause tons of complaints and have retarded amounts of dissatisfied customers. because those customers complain to the BBB/FTC, and the boiler gets turned on us. gotta watch who you're driving traffic to
 
D.T.F. said:
Was anything said about email rebills?

I'm still sending out acai to my weightloss list, and it's still converting.

How long till I get fucked?

Oh, and will the webinar be uploaded so those of us who missed it can see it again? Or was it a one time shot.
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Just got an email, NickyCakes will be uploading it to his blog.
 
my auto-responder to ftc.gov emails: "Please forward all legal documents/briefs to my esteemed legal council, Nicholas Cakes"
 
nickster said:
I think that this webinar confirmed that people running most things that need a lander (like rebills, penny auctions, insurance) will either need to go out of business or risk being prosecuted.

There is no way that an affiliate is going to do legal checks on every product he wants to split test in.

And without false claims there is no way that you can sell acai without risking falling foul of the FTC (as the shit doesn't work and any claims therefore will be false and unsubstantiated)

This webinar did the opposite of what I think Smax wanted it to do. Instead of helping affiliates to find new ways of promoting compliantly (which would have been great) it just confirmed that there basically is not really any way of promoting compliantly unless you want to spend big bucks on legal for every offer you want to run.....or......put your trust (and money) in the hands of the advertiser :)

There is one other possible way though......

Why don't the advertisers make the landers a-la-shoemoney, biz-op type landers we have seen lately. That way they can make sure everything is totally compliant and above board and they can split test the hell out of it with all the traffic they will get. Any liability will fall on their heads though.

Then the affiliates can just concentrate on traffic and ads with everything direct linked.

I know its not ideal for everyone, but it's definitely something that can be done.
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First off thanks everyone for attending we had a great turnout of over 250 people.

In response to your comment Nickster:

Actually our goal was what it always is. We're just trying to educate affiliates about things that are going on to help keep their business stable and grow. Whether you like the answer or not doesn't really matter. Sometimes the truth hurts, did you think they were going to say go do a bunch of stuff that's not compliant?

My goal was to say here's some info for your quest. It's very real and there's ways to work within the rules. While intro'ing you to some good people that can help you navigate things.

When I was an affiliate starting out, as I mentioned on the call, I didn't know anything about compliance. I'm not saying I didn't know what was right or wrong, I'm saying I didn't know even the word or the organization that governs it. I truly didn't even know compliance existed. I'm trying to help those that care and make them much more educated then I was.

That's all I wanted to accomplish and I hope I did.
 
smaxor said:
First off thanks everyone for attending we had a great turnout of over 250 people.

In response to your comment Nickster:

Actually our goal was what it always is. We're just trying to educate affiliates about things that are going on to help keep their business stable and grow. Whether you like the answer or not doesn't really matter. Sometimes the truth hurts, did you think they were going to say go do a bunch of stuff that's not compliant?

My goal was to say here's some info for your quest. It's very real and there's ways to work within the rules. While intro'ing you to some good people that can help you navigate things.

When I was an affiliate starting out, as I mentioned on the call, I didn't know anything about compliance. I'm not saying I didn't know what was right or wrong, I'm saying I didn't know even the word or the organization that governs it. I truly didn't even know compliance existed. I'm trying to help those that care and make them much more educated then I was.

That's all I wanted to accomplish and I hope I did.
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Fair enough. Don't get me wrong, I was not having a go or complaining, the webinar was excellent and very informative and we all appreciate it.

I just felt that the lawyers clarified what most people really didn't want to hear (including you), and that is that running a fully compliant landing page that converts will be close to impossible.

I still think that the best way forward is for the advertiser or the network to make the landers and that way they/you can control the compliance and the affiliates can push the traffic direct linked without having to worry about the FTC coming after them. Which in turn means more traffic for the network and advertiser.
 
Some things to keep in mind.

1) It's lawyer's job to keep you informed of every little pothole you might encounter.
2) Lawyers love laws and bureaucratic rules because thats how they get rich.
3) Lawyers are the biggest hustlers of all. They want you to run everything by them so they can bill and bank.

Use common fucking sense and don't scam people.
 
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