Going Vegan

seous said:
When you're a person who's used to eating meat and protein daily to fuel your body and you suddenly cut off that fuel source your body has to find other sources of energy to use. It'll start utilizing stored fat AND muscle for energy.

Bottom line: if you're used to eating meat frequently and you suddenly switch to another less plentiful fuel source, your body is going to start digging into reserves of fat (essentially stored pockets of back up energy) and muscle making you feel hungry even more often.

Yes, I'm seous.
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No, sorry, you still have no fucking idea what you're talking about.

Your body doesn't say, "Hey, what's up with all this vegan food?" Your body doesn't know vegan vs. non-vegan. It just knows CALORIES.

Your body calculates calories. When you receive less calories than are required to sustain your daily activities, it begins to cut into your fat stores. If your diet consists of potato chips, Coke, and Oreos (all vegan), trust me when I say that you will have plenty of excess calories.

I weigh more than I did back when I ate meat, and I've been vegan for 3 years. Broccoli and garlic sauce will do that to you.
 


brandonbaker said:
No, sorry, you still have no fucking idea what you're talking about.

Your body doesn't say, "Hey, what's up with all this vegan food?" Your body doesn't know vegan vs. non-vegan. It just knows CALORIES.
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Okay, and don't vegetables (in general) tend to be MUCH less dense in calories?
 
seous said:
Vegan = less collective amount of calories = lose more weight

That's no lie.

This is more true though:

Vegan = less calories than a normal human being is supposed to be sustained on = malnutrition = lose fat AND muscle.

Just eat a balanced diet with meat and vegetables with a caloric deficit and you'll be fine bros.
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Not sure if seous, 3800 calories yesterday, come at me bro.

On my diet I actually eat 3000+ / day.

You know how I said that some people don't eat enough and starve trying to be vegan? Those are the people you are talking about.

On top of that you are telling people to eat a caloric deficit which makes zero sense since you just said that's no good, what ??
 
Fatbat said:
We do it because we want to and because we can
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And you think this isn't the kind of thinking that has been behind every form of bigotry and subjugation that our history books are filled with?

When I walk on blades of grass, I am not harming the grass because the grass doesn't have the capacity to feel harmed.

When I throw a rock, the rock isn't harmed because it doesn't have any such capacity.

When I tear up a piece of paper, the paper isn't harmed. It cannot be harmed, it's inanimate.

But when we bring cows to slaughter, it's obvious that we're dealing with a separate issue. We are in fact harming that being, and if you're going to actively partake in the harming of another being, you should at least have some kind of moral rationalization to back it up.

So far, the only answer to "Why is it OK to eat animals?" is "Because I want to. Because I can."

But this kind of justification has always come back to bite us in the ass, historically. History books are filled with atrocities committed in the name of, "Because we can."

This is a decision we make every single day, and I'd hope that people that make this decision three times daily would have a better reason than "I want to."
 
Few things...

I'm loosely involved with bodybuilding (events + training) and I can tell you that objectively speaking, there is NOTHING impressive about Robert Cheeke's physique. He looks like he's in good shape and that's about it. In fact, most amateurs can attain Robert's physique in 2 years starting from scratch (sometimes less). His less than illustrious career tells me that meat eaters have an advantage in the bodybuilding field. I know the point was to show that vegans are not undernourished but still....

Moving on...

The real problem with food is processing (grain), pesticides (fruits + veg) and hormones (meat). Unless you're actively seeking out organic, unprocessed food (harder and more expensive than you think), I'd argue that the benefit of cutting out meat - which has its advantages admittedly - is minimal. Most of the perceived benefits are likely psychological.
 
SEOFrog said:
Few things...

I'm loosely involved with bodybuilding (events + training) and I can tell you that objectively speaking, there is NOTHING impressive about Robert Cheeke's physique. He looks like he's in good shape and that's about it. In fact, most amateurs can attain Robert's physique in 2 years starting from scratch (sometimes less). His less than illustrious career tells me that meat eaters have an advantage in the bodybuilding field. I know the point was to show that vegans are not undernourished but still....

Moving on...

The real problem with food is processing (grain), pesticides (fruits + veg) and hormones (meat). Unless you're actively seeking out organic, unprocessed food (harder and more expensive than you think), I'd argue that the benefit of cutting out meat - which has its advantages admittedly - is minimal. Most of the perceived benefits are likely psychological.
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There are few vegan bodybuilders for the same reason there are few ballet-dancing truck drivers. They have nothing to do with each other but the odds of you finding someone that is passionate about veganism and ALSO passionate about bodybuilding are pretty much nil, so the sample size is tiny.

My only point with Cheeke was that it's beyond possible to have a healthy physique on a vegan diet. It's not even that hard.

Spinach has a higher percentage of calories from protein than a Big Mac.
 
Fatbat said:
It tastes good. I like it. I enjoy it. I'm perfectly OK with raising animals for food and bringing them to slaughter. Therefore "I want to".

Anything else?
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You've defined what it means to "want to." But that wasn't my question. Don't you agree that killing another being that can feel pain and suffering is a moralistic action? That is, it can be either morally wrong or morally OK? As opposed to ripping a piece of paper which is neither.

If you agree that it's a moralistic action, it requires some kind of moralistic justification beyond "I want to."

Stealing money from people feels good. I like it. I enjoy it. I'm perfectly OK with stealing money from people. Therefore, I want to.
 
I did it for a year. As long as you eat a BALANCED vegan diet, you'll feel great. It's easy to fall into junk food vegan habits out of convenience.. Processed vegan junk. The first 6 months or so were great for me as I was constantly cooking new meals.. Lots of eastern cooking.. curries n stuff. Learn to cook lentils well and you're set ;)
 
brandonbaker said:
I challenge one person to give me a single reason why killing people is wrong but killing animals is fine.
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What does a cow provide for the earth aside from being food? If you put a gun to a cow's forehead, does it have any idea what's going on?

The only utility most animals have is that they're part of the food chain that keeps us alive.
 
SUP3RNOVA said:
What does a cow provide for the earth aside from being food? If you put a gun to a cow's forehead, does it have any idea what's going on?

The only utility most animals have is that they're part of the food chain that keeps us alive.
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On top of that, us raising cattle is probably the best thing that has ever happened for a cow before.

Now a cow doesn't need to worry about finding enough food/water. Now a cow doesn't need to worry about its habitat going extinct. Now a cow doesn't have to worry about finding a suitable partner to reproduce with.

For an unintelligent being (that can be domesticated), being a crucial part of humanity's diet is the best thing that could happen to you.
 
clear said:
After this comment, no one should be debating with you...
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Take my comment in context and you'll understand what I meant. I responded to this:

if you're used to eating meat frequently and you suddenly switch to another less plentiful fuel source, your body is going to start digging into reserves of fat (essentially stored pockets of back up energy) and muscle making you feel hungry even more often.
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This is completely untrue. Your body starts digging into its fat stores when it has a deficit in calories in vs. calories out. When it comes to using fat stores, your body responds to calories, not some bullshit measure of meat vs. non-meat.

I was practically a nutrition minor in college. Not saying that makes me an expert, but I know enough.
 
SUP3RNOVA said:
What does a cow provide for the earth aside from being food? If you put a gun to a cow's forehead, does it have any idea what's going on?

The only utility most animals have is that they're part of the food chain that keeps us alive.
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If you put a gun to an uber affiliate's forehead will he finally stop blogging and start a forum?
 
SUP3RNOVA said:
What does a cow provide for the earth aside from being food? If you put a gun to a cow's forehead, does it have any idea what's going on?

The only utility most animals have is that they're part of the food chain that keeps us alive.
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If I put a gun to a baby, does it have any idea what's going on? What about a retarded kid? What do you provide to the Earth other than destruction?
 
SUP3RNOVA said:
What does a cow provide for the earth aside from being food? If you put a gun to a cow's forehead, does it have any idea what's going on?

The only utility most animals have is that they're part of the food chain that keeps us alive.
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Ask a calf what a cow provides, and you'll surely receive a different answer.

From the perspective of a human, sure, cows are made for meat. From the perspective of the owner, slaves are also made for cotton-pickin'.
 
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