What's the point of "Occupy Wall Street"?

I'm still not optimistic about it and I think the people in the streets should be a) finding a job, b) creating a job, c) getting involved in local politics, or d) all of the above.

According to the article JakeStratham linked above, one survey has 85% of them being employed and another survey has it at 87%.

Not everyone can run for office, so after that holding up signs in public is getting involved just as much as it is for someone to have a sign on their lawn, or to write letters, or make phone calls.
 


You are regurgitating what your friends regurgitated from what they received from the media.

Yikes, more baseless assumption. I got my opinion from blogs, places that are pro-OWS (like reddit, twitter), and people that are in the city. The negative opinion only comes from myself.

You didn't do any research or engage in any level of critical thinking. You simply took what is 'common' understanding and accepted it at face value.

How?

When you were called out for being a pawn; you backtracked.

Wait, so a person can't be wrong about something? If I'm wrong and admit "I misunderstood part of the argument", I'm backtracking and being a pawn? Fuck off.
 
According to the article JakeStratham linked above, one survey has 85% of them being employed and another survey has it at 87%.

Not everyone can run for office, so after that holding up signs in public is getting involved just as much as it is for someone to have a sign on their lawn, or to write letters, or make phone calls.

As I said in that post, if these people were lobbying locally/nationally it would have a greater impact. You don't have to run for office to be involved in politics.
 
As I said in that post, if these people were lobbying locally/nationally it would have a greater impact. You don't have to run for office to be involved in politics.

It wouldn't have a greater impact unless it was coordinated and directed remotely and executed in concert. Remember people are stupid social creatures. Locally and even on the national level it's insignificant without a unified program and some kind of leadership in the face of the amount of control Wall Street exerts on society. Sometimes the best solution is to just get right in the bully's face and tell them what you think of them and see what happens.
 
I've been in the process of moving since about the time OWS took off, so I'm only getting fragments here and there... I know the news channels are lying about what OWS is because their lips are moving, but meanwhile I also know that such a large movement has no focus because it has no apparent leadership.

From the admittedly small amount of research I've done tonight on this, mostly from the ows site and this threads' links, I'm pretty psyched to think that this has a chance of helping to repeal corporate personhood, which many of you here know has been my numero uno beef with the USA since I first joined.

I mean shit, how many times have I embedded that video about it? 20? 30 friggin times?

But my worry here is that this unorganized mob is honestly not capable of seeing this as the one issue to attack that will fall all of their problems together. They don't just need more focus, they need true leadership to rise up and decide on what to focus their pressure on. And then execute.

What do you guys think the likelihood of that leadership appearing soon is?
 
Not good. Counterinsurgency is a well honed discipline and Americans are easily led astray.
I'm afraid you're right.

At this point, Anonymous has a better chance of getting something done than these guys do... And anonymous isn't even trying.

OWS'ers could really use the help of a good hacker group. Are these kids on 4chan much?
 
OWS'ers could really use the help of a good hacker group. Are these kids on 4chan much?

lol @ thinking the internet will make any difference. remember, most people are still old right now. the internet doesn't mean shit, no matter how big or viral it is. and double lol @ wanting to involve "kids" in revolutionary policy change

hackers haven't done shit, i followed it for a while and was let down. OH SHIT THEY DDOSED A SITE AND TOOK IT DOWN FOR 3 DAYS. wow you stopped like $1 mil in revenue...so tomorrow they'll make $2 mil instead of $1 mil. you guyz are changing the world!!!

an0n got solid news coverage for a while but they've fizzled out. they resorted to saying "we'll take down the NYSE" which didn't happen, and "we're taking down facebook november 5th" which won't happen.

OWS'ers don't need hackers, they need to smarten up themselves
 
Well my point there was IF they could get smarter first (leadership) they'd still need to spread their message effectively, combatting the media. I don't see any other way but hacking for that... Because the media would be forced to cover it if they hacked their message somewhere big enough. (Like on bofa.com, citibank.com, and ms.com all at the same time.)

Would that alone change the world? Of course not. But it would get a single message heard, and heard very, very loudly. The world press would eat it up. (Unless things are somehow even more tinfol-hat-like than I thought!)
 
The only way they can win is if Ron Paul wins, but Ron Paul is the end of western civilization as we know it.

I'm torn.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0kTBNMMyAa8"]Ron Paul GOP CNN Nevada Debate Responses - YouTube[/ame]
 
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsJPKMvWDmY]Howard Stern Exposes Occupy Wall St. Morons. - YouTube[/ame]
 
294773_2248400802379_1018974455_32032742_1163273294_n.jpg
 
Well the Occupy Melbourne protest (yes we had one here too) was shut down by the police today, they forcibly removed everyone from 'City Square' where they weren't causing any harm. The crowd is now blocking main roads and it's much worse, should have just let them be. Now they have something to really protest against.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DkQPI0ur5TU"]Riot Act - YouTube[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrRZBVqioeU"]Police Brutality @ Occupy Melbourne - YouTube[/ame]
 
lol @ thinking the internet will make any difference. remember, most people are still old right now. the internet doesn't mean shit, no matter how big or viral it is. and double lol @ wanting to involve "kids" in revolutionary policy change

Famous last words of authoritarians around the globe.
The big issue is getting things to leave the internet and join the meatspace...which is exactly what OWS has done. Our group has people who are 50-60+, don't have a twitter, don't have a Facebook. They heard about it from the penetration the internet has into the old media and via flyers and whatnot.

hackers haven't done shit, i followed it for a while and was let down. OH SHIT THEY DDOSED A SITE AND TOOK IT DOWN FOR 3 DAYS. wow you stopped like $1 mil in revenue...so tomorrow they'll make $2 mil instead of $1 mil. you guyz are changing the world!!!

Sony lost millions and millions of dollars. Their stock price went down by ~25% during the attacks. But most importantly: Do you think they'll sue a guy like Geohot again? I don't.

The goal isn't the direct action. The goal is to create a system where people sitting in a board room have to think of 3 things: Instead of just "what will the shareholders think" and "what will the government think", I want them to have to add "what will the internet think". The day that becomes a consideration(and we're getting there) anonymous has won.

an0n got solid news coverage for a while but they've fizzled out. they resorted to saying "we'll take down the NYSE" which didn't happen, and "we're taking down facebook november 5th" which won't happen.

Their coverage is going down, but they're still active. In the past few days they hit another set of police sites run by a government contractor and leaked information about the departments hostile to the OWS protests.

Additionally they've been tracking down the CEOs of banks, finding their home address. They've done this for Goldman, Chase, Citibank, and I think one more. They also got the police officer who pepper sprayed the girls at OWS.

Their other activity recently was taking down a .onion hosting provider that was hosting a butt ton of child porn.

OWS'ers don't need hackers, they need to smarten up themselves

Think of Anonymous as the wild attack dog of OWS. Their actions don't directly reflect on them, but they operate as a support structure. OWS would have issues releasing the contact information for cops and bankers, so anonymous does it instead.
 
I'm afraid you're right.

At this point, Anonymous has a better chance of getting something done than these guys do... And anonymous isn't even trying.

OWS'ers could really use the help of a good hacker group. Are these kids on 4chan much?
Anonymous has been pumping up OWS since the beginning, and helping them along the way. Aside from early recruiting(Before the unions and other organized groups joined), they've been tracking down "abusive" police officers, home addresses for bank CEOs, attacking police departments that attack OWS, and a variety of other things. They also have a VERY noticeable presence at most "occupy" movements.

They're going slow for sure...it seems they have forgotten about life ruin tactics. But they're there.
 
I ran across the following today (this is the kind of stuff that makes my skin crawl):

Occupy America-Doctrine

“……government of the people, by the people…..”

1) Financial Crisis-Responsibility:

Every Board Member and member of the Executive Management Team of any and all companies that had any knowledge of the lending abuses of the last decade should resign from those companies without severance pay and be banned from the banking/lending business for minimum period of 10 years. If the resignation does not occur by December 31, 2011, these Board and executive members will be prosecuted for fraud. If the State and Federal governments do not finance or support the suits, the members of the OWS will finance the suits on behalf of public interest and the shareholders of said companies.

2) Short & Long Term Stimulus:

Any Senate or House member that does not support (vote in favor) of immediate and long term programs to put American’s back to work, will be asked to resign from their seats by December 31, 2011. If the members of the Senate and House do not vote to create jobs, the OWS will organize to support any new candidate for the next election in the incumbents city, district, or state. The OWS will organize to support such opposition candidates and will actively recruit supporters to get the vote out against said incumbent.

3) Reallocation of Funds:

The OWS is insisting that there be an immediate pull out of all troops and equipment from Iraq and Afghanistan. The Senate and the House of Representatives will reallocate all the funds (budget) the Government was spending annually on the two wars, for rebuilding highways, bridges (infrastructure), schools, and for teachers salaries and school supplies as the school systems require.

4) American Jobs & Trade:

The USA should not allow any imports (dollar for dollar) to be exported into the USA unless the U.S. companies can ship an equivalent of American made goods to those same exporting countries. Import and Export trade is to be monitored dollar for dollar. (Ex. If China exports USD $1 Billion in goods to USA, then USA must be allowed to ship the same USD $1 Billion to China. China will not be able to ship $1 more of goods or services than what the USA ships to China). The tariffs, duties, taxes, tax incentives for all trading parties cannot exceed the USA tariffs, duties, taxes, and tax incentives, dollar for dollar.

5) Reinvigorating the housing industry:

Housing is the back bone of the U.S. economy. The U.S. Government must guarantee home loans for any American with a job at a rate of a maximum of 1% over a 40 year payment term, with a maximum down payment of 5% for any and all “existing” homes (not new homes). In exchange, the Government will maintain a 25% equity interest in all homes in the program. The government will forfeit their equity interest if the homeowner does not default within the first 20 years (240 months) of said loan.

6) Education:

Any elementary, middle or high school that improves their “proven and verified” test scores by a minimum of 10% for the entire student body will reward the teaching staff , office and support staff with a bonus at the end of each school year in the amount of 10% of the base salary. If the same school increase the overall test scores by 15%, then the bonus will be equal to 15%. This incentive will be instituted for a minimum period of ten (10) years. For every high school that reaches a 90% acceptance rate for their graduating seniors to a junior college or better, will receive a 10% bonus from base salary from the State for the high school teachers, office and support staff of that high school.


7) Oil Dependence:

a) Auto Companies: They will be required to provide the American public, vehicles that provide 60 MPG no later December 31, 2014, or be charged a fuel tax of $2000 for every vehicle sold in the USA.
b) Major Oil Companies: Charged an import fee of 25% of all net profits generated from U.S. sales generated from imported oil sold in America. Circumvention will be punished and treated as Treason.
c) Federal Tax credit for oil companies for 35% of the cost to find/locate oil generated from the U.S. territories.

8) Taxes:

Reform the U.S. Tax code no later than December 2012. Amnesty for any individual or company for repatriating any funds/profits presently located overseas. Reduce taxes to zero (0) for anyone making less than $25,000/year. Instituting a flat tax for individuals, and corporations to encourage investment in America. This is where we start
Conor Friedersdorf's rebuttal.