Confused Believer

^^^
Newton was a strong god believer. So, I posted it for the atheists

Not a captain random of course.

I'm sure this had nothing to do with the fact that he grew up in a time where heresy was punishable by death...

(not saying he was a secret atheist or anything, but obviously being a product of that environment will have had a big influence on his non-scientific beliefs)
 


^^^
That article comes from a site with a dog in the fight.

General news article. 1/3 not 7%. Plus another 18% believe in a higher power. 41% dont believe in either.
http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/go...od-gap-between-scientists-and-other-americans

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^^^
That article comes from a site with a dog in the fight.

General news article. 1/3 not 7%. Plus another 18% believe in a higher power. 41% dont believe in either.
Pew Survey: A Huge God Gap Between Scientists and Other Americans - God & Country (usnews.com)

Of course polls differ, (especially when they poll a different group of scientists) so using these two polls we are lead to concluded somewhere there's a happy medium between 7-30 percent of scientists who do not believe in a god. Compared with 83% of the typically less intelligent general public that do.... soooooo...your point?
 

Thats some weak 'data' in defence of your argument. Expecially when Lukep was talking about if you beleive in the bible then it'd be hard to grasp advanced biology since biology relies on evolution - which the bible does not support. If you DO beleive in evolution, then i find it extremely hard to beleive how you can also beleive in any of todays religions at the same time because they both go completely against each other.

You've replied with a half baked study on how intelligent religious people are, which misses Lukep's point i think.
The article clearly states:

"
“It all falls down to what you consider to be religious,” said Schwadel, an assistant professor at the University of Nebraska-Lincoln. “If it’s simply attending religious services, then no. Highly educated people are not less religious; in fact, they’re more religious.”
But if it’s saying the Bible is the literal word of God and saying that only one religion is the true religion, then they are less religious,” he continued."

Notice the bit in bold. It means the more intelligent you are, the LESS likely you are to beleive in the bible being the literal word of God, and that one religion is the only true religion. (Given that the bible doesnt allow for worshipping other Gods, then the group of people who simply attend church cannot be classed as truly religious and therefore the intelligence level doesnt really apply in this situation.)

The study highlights that intelligent people go to church. Big deal, atheists go to church all the time for funerals, weddings, social reasons etc, that doesnt mean they beleive in god, and completely skews the data of the study.

I've yet to watch your YouTube video as i'm watching something else atm but will maybe watch later, but i don't hold out much hope for it judging by the quality of the other 'data' you posted.

To be honest i thought you were replying to LukeP to show how religion doesnt hinder you from studying and understanding biology or the nature of the planets etc.... but the discussion has went a different way entirely.



So for that reason...





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Rusky, my point was that religion puts up roadblocks to an education in science.

Posting proof that there are smart scientists out there is IRRELEVANT. Even the percentages. Perhaps a religious person, when faced with the adversity of the roadblocks I'm talking about, will take it upon himself to work harder than atheists have to and overcome that roadblock... Perhaps 100% of all religious scientists had to do this.

I'm trying to be nice about this but please try to calm down and play the game correctly. Calling the statement "Horseshit" and then arguing about some other point I never mentioned just makes you look like a moron with ADHD.
 
blah blah blah

lulz @ bigoted atheists thinking they can even buy a loaf of bread that's pure from religious oppression.

Personally, I've hired multiple atheists, christians, catholics & a few hindu .... Sadly, I can't find a jew broke enough to accept a job. I've never once considered what religion people are when I'm a buyer or seller. What a tremendous market advantage I have over you ... sounds like evolution somehow left your ass behind.

Imagine you were going to do business with someone (where there is a possibility of losing your investment or where they could do harm to your brand/properties/reputation). Suppose you found out during a conversation that this person believed in The Power Of The Force from Starwars. Not just superficially or metaphorically, but that 'The Force' permeated and affected their perspective of the world, and their decisions and actions.

Hello, that's not a business partner ... that's fucking marriage material!!

especially in the branch of Biology where clearly every drive behind our growth is Evolution.

I think the word you're looking for is survival, evolution is just a byproduct. It's the same reason a fetus moves away from a needle during abortions.

Out of all the billions of people in the world who have existed and died due to genetic diseases, viruses, bacteria and 'evil', if your god created all these things in the first place then i think its clear who the biggest mass murderer is.

Ouch. That there is some painful medicine... Sure to fall on deaf ears.

Nope, no pain involved for anyone who has done 5 minutes of critical thinking on it. You really can't see how bacteria could be beneficial to an intelligent designer?

This is very weak argument and it sounds like grasping for straws TBH. Seriously, take the gun off safety and aim somewhere besides your foot before firing the next round

@rusky .. you know of a link to that USSR video with english subs. Reading what was said add much depth, the old generation they interviewed probably remember the years after WWII very, very well.
 
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... if you beleive in the bible then it'd be hard to grasp advanced biology since biology relies on evolution - which the bible does not support.

The bible doesn't "support" super computers or the Pythagorean Theorem either ... religion has no problem with any of these things. I think you might be confused about what evolution is.
 
Nope, no pain involved for anyone who has done 5 minutes of critical thinking on it. You really can't see how bacteria could be beneficial to an intelligent designer?
Clarification: I didn't say "ouch" because his point totally disproves a god; I said ouch because his point (God is a Mass Murderer) is painful for theists to consider. Hench the Ouch.

Any intelligent being who creates billions of people and then creates germs, viruses, predators, wars, inquisitions, etc and yadda yadda to destroy most of them painfully is just not playing the role of a loving father very damn well.
 
Clarification: I didn't say "ouch" because his point totally disproves a god; I said ouch because his point (God is a Mass Murderer) is painful for theists to consider. Hench the Ouch.

Any intelligent being who creates billions of people and then creates germs, viruses, predators, wars, inquisitions, etc and yadda yadda to destroy most of them painfully is just not playing the role of a loving father very damn well.


Children do not always understand the actions of their parents, especially when very young, the child being closer to the parent in understanding and depth at any age differential than any human is ever to God. How then is it that you can know enough to judge God?
 
The bible doesn't "support" super computers or the Pythagorean Theorem either ... religion has no problem with any of these things. I think you might be confused about what evolution is.

What an utterly rediculous and irrelevant comparison to make.

The reason the bible is incompatable with the theory of evolution is because it says god created man in his image in the space of a few days, where as the theory of evolution states we have evolved over millions of years to get to where we are now. You simply cannot beleive both to be true at the same time unless you bend the rules, but i noticed you slipped in 'Intelligent Designer' into your post so no prizes for guessing where thats headed.

I don't see how a man made invention like computers, or pythagoras theorem has anything to do with what im talking about. Computers are an invention which didnt exist at the time the book was written, yet upon their invention, they didn't bear any contradictions to the teachings of the bible so of course religion is cool with it, so it should be.

However, just like evolution, right angled triangles did exist at the time of the bible - there was just no way to calculate the area of them etc, but unlike the theory of evolution, the bible has no problems with pythagoras theory because it doesnt fly in the face of everything it teaches.

In regards to the bacteria thing, of course i think bacteria is beneficial. I'd be interested in hearing why you think bacteria would be beneficial to an intelligent designer who could quite easily have created everything perfect in the first place though, and if you're going to praise bacteria for it's beneficial properties, then you better have a similar argument for disease and viruses, so yep... cant wait to hear of the benefit of having those vs not having them. Don't forget to add in genetic disorders and deformities... God has a reason for creating everything, even people who are born in wrything agony with deformed limbs and severely disfunctional organs, only to die a few minutes into their life, drowning in their own blood.

You talk about clutching at straws and weak arguments, yet your own post is basically taking 1 liner pot shots at other people while adding absolutely zero to the actual discussion.

I was supposed to be gone from this thread, i think now REIMtkg has graced us with his presence it might be a good time to bail out before his inane ramblings burn their way through my iris and eventually start effecting my brain with his sorcery.
 
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Clarification: I didn't say "ouch" because his point totally disproves a god; I said ouch because his point (God is a Mass Murderer) is painful for theists to consider. Hench the Ouch.

Everything that has a beginning has an end Mr. Anderson.

-or-

Good death, bad death ... you're still dead.

You'll have a better argument if you just change it to "why didn't he make us all immortal". But that's just silly talk, why would you go there?

The reason the bible is incompatable with the theory of evolution is because it says god created man in his image in the space of a few days, where as the theory of evolution states we have evolved over millions of years to get to where we are now.

Define how long a day was when the Earth was being created please. Once you've done that, spend some time thinking about how you got the right to decide what's compatible with other people's ideas/beliefs.

You simply cannot beleive both to be true at the same time unless you bend the rules, but i noticed you slipped in 'Intelligent Designer' into your post so no prizes for guessing where thats headed.

Anything capable of creating human beings I believe fits in the definition of "intelligent".

Yet your own post is basically taking 1 liner pot shots at other people while adding absolutely zero to the actual discussion.

When you make an argument I didn't have figured out in the 8th grade I'm happy to type you a paragraph.
 
Everything that has a beginning has an end Mr. Anderson.

-or-

Good death, bad death ... you're still dead.

You'll have a better argument if you just change it to "why didn't he make us all immortal". But that's just silly talk, why would you go there?



Define how long a day was when the Earth was being created please. Once you've done that, spend some time thinking about how you got the right to decide what's compatible with other people's ideas/beliefs.

If the bible is the word of God, then why does it use the word DAY in the bible when DAY is a man made word to describe 24 hours?

Surely there'd be a better way of describing the length of time it took to create the earth if it indeed took much much longer, or is this just another 'interpretation' of the bible you've modified to fit your needs i wonder.

When you make an argument I didn't have figured out in the 8th grade I'm happy to type you a paragraph. More words don't make a more thorough argument.
Interesting, because i get a more thought provoking conversation from my 10yr old than i do from you, so touche.

You still never answered my bacteria / virus / disease question.... or do you have that all figured out as well?
 
If the bible is the word of God, then why does it use the word DAY in the bible when DAY is a man made word to describe 24 hours?

Surely there'd be a better way of describing the length of time it took to create the earth if it indeed took much much longer, or is this just another 'interpretation' of the bible you've modified to fit your needs i wonder.

You're right, measurements in light years would have fit right into the way cave people thought.

IYou still never answered my bacteria / virus / disease question.... or do you have that all figured out as well?

discovery and resilience ... next
 
You're right, measurements in light years would have fit right into the way cave people thought.



discovery and resilience ... next


Admits bible was written by cave people and uses their lack of intelligence to excuse their inability to write a definition for time anywhere inbetween a day and a light year.


Believes everything cave people wrote.


I end my case. Discovery and resilience, is that the best you can do?
 
Admits bible was written by cave people and uses their lack of intelligence to excuse their inability to write a definition for time anywhere inbetween a day and a light year.

So would a light year have been understood even 300 years ago? How about 200?

Believes everything cave people wrote.

erect said:
Once you've done that, spend some time thinking about how you got the right to decide what's compatible with other people's ideas/beliefs.

In other words, you have zero idea what my beliefs are, were and will be.

I end my case. Discovery and resilience, is that the best you can do?

There's plenty more but it's all I need. You'd suck as a lawyer if that's your closing statement.
 
"Once you've done that, spend some time thinking about how you got the right to decide what's compatible with other people's ideas/beliefs."


^^ If you're going to revert back to that everytime someone questions your beliefs in a religious debate then there'd be no need for a lawyer.:action-smiley-027:
 
So would a light year have been understood even 300 years ago? How about 200?

Sigh.... My point is.... even back then.... i'm sure they had words, and methods of explaining lengths of time which exceeded a day.

They could have said 'longer than a day', "much much longer than a day!!" but they didnt.

You're the one who brought up light years.