The Debate the just ended......

Y RP comes off like a smart ass know it all and has no mass appeal, Gingrich is not likeable and has baggage, and I do not know the rest of the field.


He comes off as a smart ass, because he's intelligent enough to actually come to the conclusions of what is happening right now before anyone else does. He may be old, but he is wise, and sees the mistakes made in the past and how they influence the future. That is more than can be said with pretty much any other politicians. He's been telling us for years what is going to happen and it's come true. He sticks to his guns and votes for liberty, again more than anyone else out there. He does not give a fuck what others think. He has a track record of that. Again probably better than anyone.

You can not beat such a man with such conviction (at least you shouldn't be able to). Granted he may have a few views that don't fit the Republican agenda but we all know it's impossible to run for president as an independent in this country. Doesn't mean I wouldn't vote for him if he didn't get the Republican nomination. Otherwise I'm voting between a douche bag and a turd sandwich like usual.

The question is, will you vote for liberty or will you vote for 4 more years of the same bullshit? A vote for Obama or a vote for whomever besides Paul may win the Republican nomination is probably a vote for the same thing. Mitt, lulz, that asshole is the same as Obama and has a track record to prove it.

I also love how the media is trying to down play the Ames straw poll now that RP will probably win it. If anyone else would win it, they'd be all over their nuts (admitted by the candidates which is why they run for this poll - the media attention they'd get from it).

Any ways, haters going to hate. We've had pretty old presidents in the past and the youth has show that it can't get it done. Maybe we need to take a step back and re-evaluate who we elect. However by all means stick your head in the sand, it's much easier when you don't have to think about it.
 


Fun fact: RP won just about every straw poll/Internet poll there was last election as well. Guess how that ended up?

This is just a repeat of the last election. The Repub puppetmasters will not allow RP to win the GOP nomination. He's never treated as a serious candidate even on the 'unfair and unbalanced' fox news where he should be seen as royalty.

I'm not saying you shouldn't vote for him, or that I won't, but he has to be at least polling decent/close in "real" polls when it gets close to election time. It doesn't matter what people on the Internet think about this guy, it matters what joe blow thinks about him. If he can't get the polls close enough so that my vote could sway the election, then it's wasted. If it's close in the polls, then by all means vote for him and give him the push he needs.

The problem is that if the average person isn't inspired by his speeches, his ideas, and the man himself, then he cannot get elected right now. It's a little like being a pop star--doesn't matter if you have a great voice if you're a 300lb whale, no one will sign you. It's the presentation. Obama had that in spades and generally crushes in debates, which is why so many Repubs were scared to run this time.

This is an interesting site that could be the future of how we vote: Americans Elect 2012 | The first-ever open presidential nomination -- if it's really all about ideas and finding someone that aligns with your own, I can't see it getting much simpler than that.

p.s. F you whoever neg repped me on some random post.
 
You are truly a mind fucked pussy if you think RP can not win the Rep candidacy, he leads almost every poll.
 
RP comes off like a smart ass know it all and has no mass appeal

RP may come off as a smart ass because hes speaking and debating with half retarded mongoloids most of the time. He will shit on anyone in a debate, he has none of the bullshit fluff you get from every other candidate R or D, all RP debates with is facts, dates, statistics, ect. Who else can rattle off significant dates in history that shaped our country.
 
1. RP wants to phase in the gold standard? - do not want.
2. RP does not support Israel - dealbreaker
3. RP speaks against earmarks except when he puts them in bills he votes against because he knows they will pass. Just a hypocrite like everyone else.
4. RP wants free trade but votes down agreements - you have to govern somehow - he is not in a bubble - he cannot pout and go away when no one agrees with him - there is a point where you need to build consensus - or nothing will happen and he will be a big fail as a president.
5. RP believes in prayer in schools - I am good with that but I am surprised WF is.
6. RP believes in prohibiting flag burning? Really? What happened to freedom? He believes in civil disobedience against taxes but not flag burning? He should remember that the symbol of the freedom is not more important than the freedom itself.
7. RP wants parallel currencies - really? Markets need stability. Markets needs a defined set of rules. Markets do not need uncertainly.
8. RP beleives in creating some sort of special non taxed employee owned corporations? Is he a union shill or a communist in disguise?
9. He is staunchly anti abortion? I am OK with this but is WF? He, as president, will be choosing the next Supreme Court justices. Even though he believes it should not be up to the Supreme Court - in reality it is.
10. RP believes state senators need to elect the US Senators? As a person that understands politics in CA - no thanks. Of course we still have two big Dem's as US senators but at least we have a chance to throw them out - with RP's program and reapportionment as it is - we would never have a chance.


Is he just another better or two evils or do you guys really like this guy?
 
1. RP wants to phase in the gold standard? - do not want.
2. RP does not support Israel - dealbreaker
3. RP speaks against earmarks except when he puts them in bills he votes against because he knows they will pass. Just a hypocrite like everyone else.
4. RP wants free trade but votes down agreements - you have to govern somehow - he is not in a bubble - he cannot pout and go away when no one agrees with him - there is a point where you need to build consensus - or nothing will happen and he will be a big fail as a president.
5. RP believes in prayer in schools - I am good with that but I am surprised WF is.
6. RP believes in prohibiting flag burning? Really? What happened to freedom? He believes in civil disobedience against taxes but not flag burning? He should remember that the symbol of the freedom is not more important than the freedom itself.
7. RP wants parallel currencies - really? Markets need stability. Markets needs a defined set of rules. Markets do not need uncertainly.
8. RP beleives in creating some sort of special non taxed employee owned corporations? Is he a union shill or a communist in disguise?
9. He is staunchly anti abortion? I am OK with this but is WF? He, as president, will be choosing the next Supreme Court justices. Even though he believes it should not be up to the Supreme Court - in reality it is.
10. RP believes state senators need to elect the US Senators? As a person that understands politics in CA - no thanks. Of course we still have two big Dem's as US senators but at least we have a chance to throw them out - with RP's program and reapportionment as it is - we would never have a chance.


Is he just another better or two evils or do you guys really like this guy?

Can you point out any of those instances where he says he wouldn't follow the constitution and attempt to enact any of those 'ideas'. Over almost 4 decades of public speaking I'm sure I would have some radical thoughts as well. RP also has a tendancy to talk outloud on ideas as "something we could look into".... and some of those things would require an amendment to the constitution. Which would make it a public debate and dependent on congress/senate as well.
 
I should also point out that I don't know a single person on the planet who I agree with every point on.

I could give a rats ass about their religion (prefer they don't have one really) but as long as they believe in the constitution and the rule of law I can deal with them being a vodoo priest :)
 
If the RP crazies mobilize and get Paul as the candidate he will get trounced in the election. Therefore a vote for Paul in the primary is a vote for Obama.

Ron has a far better chance in the general election than the GOP ... IF he gets the republican nod, obama will lose by >10% thanks to RP's classic liberal ideals and his appeal to the independents.

It's all about the war and the economy, RP pwns the status quo in both areas. Honestly, Bachmann is the only thing that stands between him and the white house.
 
1. RP wants to phase in the gold standard? - do not want.

RP believes in competition, gold and silver would be competition for paper ... which has more value?

2. RP does not support Israel - dealbreaker

RP supports Israel more than any other candidate. It's addition by subtraction, if israel gets $1 they're enemies get $7 ... RP want to take that $8 and put it in our borders. If you want to call that being against israel or anti-Semitic, I guess you're welcome to that opinion, it's wrong though.

3. RP speaks against earmarks except when he puts them in bills he votes against because he knows they will pass. Just a hypocrite like everyone else.

Because he knows how the system works, he's able to take care of his house (his constituents) while still voting his morals.

I get that his reasoning here makes him look like a politician. Here's an analogy to help you digest his stance

North Dakota is the only state that has it's own bank (just under 100 years old). Why is this important? Well because when rules are set, you don't have to agree with them in order to take care of your house. ND's bank issues out no interest loans to different areas of the government and residents. THEIR PEOPLE ARE NOT GETTING RAPED LIKE THE OTHER 49 STATES! Check out the site and look at the great things they can do for the state while keeping only 10% reserves in the bank. Hell, they could charge negative interest rates and still profit to high hell just because 90% of the loan was free to them.

Fuck the fractional reserve system ... it's hard to fail under that system, yet many do. Unfucking believable.

Is this bank fraudulent? Sure, every bank based on the fractional system is
Can you stop it? Nope, law of the land thanks to status quo
Would you take part? Tough question, but if you don't want your house to get the shaft, you really don't have a choice.

Paul takes care of the people that vote for him, he's truly a leader for his people.
This isn't his system but he's still #winning

4. RP wants free trade but votes down agreements - you have to govern somehow - he is not in a bubble - he cannot pout and go away when no one agrees with him - there is a point where you need to build consensus - or nothing will happen and he will be a big fail as a president.

Depends on how you define fail. I vote gridlock so that nothing happens in DC ... under the current system, I think that's the only positive thing that can happen in government.

Even if everything is stalemate (which it won't be, politicians change their positions in order to get votes and if RP gets elected, the votes are obviously there.), RP can do massive good just by using executive power to trim the federal registry fat. All budgets will be balanced because with the executive power foreign war ends and US defense and economical growth begins.

If he gets voted in by the general population, you better believe both sides of the isle will be lining up to help him. They'll know they're the sheep to be slaughtered if not.


5. RP believes in prayer in schools - I am good with that but I am surprised WF is.

RP believes in getting DC out of schools. Let the states deal with prayers (or marijuana legalization, etc) and if you don't like it, move to another state that doesn't allow it. That's the way it's supposed to be.

6. RP believes in prohibiting flag burning? Really? What happened to freedom? He believes in civil disobedience against taxes but not flag burning? He should remember that the symbol of the freedom is not more important than the freedom itself.

Source please, he's into personal liberty and freedom of expression ... this is kind of tough to swallow

7. RP wants parallel currencies - really? Markets need stability. Markets needs a defined set of rules. Markets do not need uncertainly.

See #1

Market stability depends on production, not monetary policy. We've been productive DESPITE not having competition (the cornerstone of a free market) and we will thrive with monetary competition because when we produce, we'll keep 100% of our fruits instead of having our income slashed by devaluation of our dollar (fruits of MY labor) by printing more. We're doing ok despite not having money competition, imagine the economical boost of sound money. Either way, there's no getting worse than what we currently have .. no choice.

Hell I'd accept swiss francs at a discount right now if I had that option.

8. RP beleives in creating some sort of special non taxed employee owned corporations? Is he a union shill or a communist in disguise?

He also believes in no income tax for drug dealers and prostitutes .. ooh yeah, you and me too. That "non taxed employee owned corporations" get lumped into that is a non-issue to me.

Business tax loopholes and tax rates on the rich aren't the issue ... foreign military spending is. Remove that and we don't need all this unconstitutional income tax bullshit to remain solvent.


9. He is staunchly anti abortion? I am OK with this but is WF? He, as president, will be choosing the next Supreme Court justices. Even though he believes it should not be up to the Supreme Court - in reality it is.

Judge Napolitano for Supreme Court Justice!!!

Again, he's a states rights guy, DC shouldn't be able to control decisions people make in Alaska. By going constitutional with SC appointees, it'll sway balanceto the constitutional position .. which is states rights.

He thinks abortion is wrong for him and his family, but it's up to the states to set the laws for the citizens ... NOT DC. if you don't like the way your state laws are, find a friendly state where you can open an abortion clinic.


Really, this states rights stuff is huge!!! It gives all of us choices to live amongst like minded people. We do not have that now, unless you argue virtually, and it would be a welcomed change

10. RP believes state senators need to elect the US Senators? As a person that understands politics in CA - no thanks. Of course we still have two big Dem's as US senators but at least we have a chance to throw them out - with RP's program and reapportionment as it is - we would never have a chance.

Feel free to keep this grudge, I really don't care either way since the system is corrupt at it's core. Whether it's the state senators (voted by the people) or the news media giants that pick our rulers, we fail.

In the end, whatever system we have the people get the gov't they want ... if you want to say that RP isn't going to win, you can start there. With few exceptions, Americans are lazy sobs who only want a handout.


Is he just another better or two evils or do you guys really like this guy?

I'm a belieber and have maxed out donations for a long time, there is no other politician that I would support my children / grandchildren going to war for ... because under him, I'll know it's necessary.

4chr
 
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6. RP believes in prohibiting flag burning? Really? What happened to freedom? He believes in civil disobedience against taxes but not flag burning? He should remember that the symbol of the freedom is not more important than the freedom itself.

Source please, he's into personal liberty and freedom of expression ... this is kind of tough to swallow


REIMktg is likely referring to this. I believe Paul did indeed vote for it. However, it is worth reading his statement on the matter since the bill was not a simple issue for him:

The Flag Burning Amendment by Rep. Ron Paul

Also worth reading from a very smart mind:

Ron Paul distortions and smears - Glenn Greenwald - Salon.com
 
inb4 the media says that us internet hackers scewed the poll somehow --- or they try to invalidate it in some fashion.

OR

Maybe a few of them will start reporting honestly for a change.
 
1. RP wants to phase in the gold standard? - do not want.

RP believes in competition, gold and silver would be competition for paper ... which has more value?

The point of the gold standard is that it severely restricts economic growth. I believe you are referring to his advocating competing currencies.

2. RP does not support Israel - dealbreaker

RP supports Israel more than any other candidate. It's addition by subtraction, if israel gets $1 they're enemies get $7 ... RP want to take that $8 and put it in our borders. If you want to call that being against israel or anti-Semitic, I guess you're welcome to that opinion, it's wrong though.

I am subscribing to your math. His lack of support for Israel is a real problem for me.

3. RP speaks against earmarks except when he puts them in bills he votes against because he knows they will pass. Just a hypocrite like everyone else.

Because he knows how the system works, he's able to take care of his house (his constituents) while still voting his morals.

I get that his reasoning here makes him look like a politician. Here's an analogy to help you digest his stance


Is this bank fraudulent? Sure, every bank based on the fractional system is
Can you stop it? Nope, law of the land thanks to status quo
Would you take part? Tough question, but if you don't want your house to get the shaft, you really don't have a choice.

Paul takes care of the people that vote for him, he's truly a leader for his people.
This isn't his system but he's still #winning

He is a hypocrite to put in earmarks and then speak out against them. That is not a leader.

As far as you bank argument goes - I am good with what you have said - but it has nothing to do with RP.

4. RP wants free trade but votes down agreements - you have to govern somehow - he is not in a bubble - he cannot pout and go away when no one agrees with him - there is a point where you need to build consensus - or nothing will happen and he will be a big fail as a president.

Depends on how you define fail. I vote gridlock so that nothing happens in DC ... under the current system, I think that's the only positive thing that can happen in government.

Even if everything is stalemate (which it won't be, politicians change their positions in order to get votes and if RP gets elected, the votes are obviously there.), RP can do massive good just by using executive power to trim the federal registry fat. All budgets will be balanced because with the executive power foreign war ends and US defense and economical growth begins.

If he gets voted in by the general population, you better believe both sides of the isle will be lining up to help him. They'll know they're the sheep to be slaughtered if not.

You are believing in a fantasy. If RP wins it would be by a thin margin - you RP advocates are not going to change the extreme voters of either side - maybe just some independents. RP will not be able to do anything he advocates and he will ostracize everyone because he is a smart ass that always feels he is the smartest in the room.


5. RP believes in prayer in schools - I am good with that but I am surprised WF is.

RP believes in getting DC out of schools. Let the states deal with prayers (or marijuana legalization, etc) and if you don't like it, move to another state that doesn't allow it. That's the way it's supposed to be.

Fine by me - we agree on this.


6. RP believes in prohibiting flag burning? Really? What happened to freedom? He believes in civil disobedience against taxes but not flag burning? He should remember that the symbol of the freedom is not more important than the freedom itself.

Source please, he's into personal liberty and freedom of expression ... this is kind of tough to swallow

It appears that RP wastes taxpayer money by putting up fake legislation to make his point that we are making unconstitutional law - while it appears wikipedia was wrong (no surprise there I hate WikiPedia) about his flag burning support - it then opens up the issue of his hypocracy on wasting taxpayer dollars.

7. RP wants parallel currencies - really? Markets need stability. Markets needs a defined set of rules. Markets do not need uncertainly.

See #1

Market stability depends on production, not monetary policy. We've been productive DESPITE not having competition (the cornerstone of a free market) and we will thrive with monetary competition because when we produce, we'll keep 100% of our fruits instead of having our income slashed by devaluation of our dollar (fruits of MY labor) by printing more. We're doing ok despite not having money competition, imagine the economical boost of sound money. Either way, there's no getting worse than what we currently have .. no choice.

Hell I'd accept swiss francs at a discount right now if I had that option.

You are wrong on this. The market needs a stable system of exchange to function properly. Multiple competing currencies do not provide stability. All of these RP experiments would throw the economy into havoc.

I do not know exactly how it works - because I am really do not know - but it seems inflation hurts the lending class much more than the lower classes (borrower classes) even though RP claims the opposite.

8. RP beleives in creating some sort of special non taxed employee owned corporations? Is he a union shill or a communist in disguise?

He also believes in no income tax for drug dealers and prostitutes .. ooh yeah, you and me too. That "non taxed employee owned corporations" get lumped into that is a non-issue to me.

Business tax loopholes and tax rates on the rich aren't the issue ... foreign military spending is. Remove that and we don't need all this unconstitutional income tax bullshit to remain solvent.

I understand your tax views and agree on many levels. But that is not what I read . Having a special non-taxed employee owned corp is a very communist idea - not certain what he is thinking on that one. I know you think it was a part of an overall no tax plan of his but then why break out the employee owned corp? Are employees more worthy than stockholder/investors?

9. He is staunchly anti abortion? I am OK with this but is WF? He, as president, will be choosing the next Supreme Court justices. Even though he believes it should not be up to the Supreme Court - in reality it is.

Judge Napolitano for Supreme Court Justice!!!

Again, he's a states rights guy, DC shouldn't be able to control decisions people make in Alaska. By going constitutional with SC appointees, it'll sway balanceto the constitutional position .. which is states rights.

He thinks abortion is wrong for him and his family, but it's up to the states to set the laws for the citizens ... NOT DC. if you don't like the way your state laws are, find a friendly state where you can open an abortion clinic.


Really, this states rights stuff is huge!!! It gives all of us choices to live amongst like minded people. We do not have that now, unless you argue virtually, and it would be a welcomed change

I understand states rights - I am for states rights and a smaller Central Govt. I was just pointing out my surprise that WF support him. He will not win many Dem voters with that stance.

10. RP believes state senators need to elect the US Senators? As a person that understands politics in CA - no thanks. Of course we still have two big Dem's as US senators but at least we have a chance to throw them out - with RP's program and reapportionment as it is - we would never have a chance.

Feel free to keep this grudge, I really don't care either way since the system is corrupt at it's core. Whether it's the state senators (voted by the people) or the news media giants that pick our rulers, we fail.

In the end, whatever system we have the people get the gov't they want ... if you want to say that RP isn't going to win, you can start there. With few exceptions, Americans are lazy sobs who only want a handout.

You are more cynical than I. The news influences the rulers - yes. But if RP were less of a smart ass he would get more support. You see no one likes a no it all smart ass nerd. Sure he is smart - so what. He's still an ass and not likeable.

There is a legit reason for my wanting the senators chosen by popular vote and I cited it by referring to the redistricting problem in CA. Without the popular vote we would not stand a chance.

Is he just another better of two evils or do you guys really like this guy?

I'm a believer and have maxed out donations for a long time, there is no other politician that I would support my children / grandchildren going to war for ... because under him, I'll know it's necessary.

I never studied him much until my last post. I will say that he has some good ideas - but he comes off like an idiot.

I see all the RP lovers enjoying the YouTube video of hm and Bernake over "if gold is money" - as far as I am concerned RP looks like a dumb ass jerk and Bernake, though he paused, won the discussion. Is there any place you can point me that shows RP as someone that can govern?
 
Ron Paul is too old, Gary Johnson is better. I don't think Ron will last 4 years as president, let alone 8 years. Its very exhausting being president.

Rand Paul > Gary Johnson > Ron Paul
 
You are wrong on this. The market needs a stable system of exchange to function properly. Multiple competing currencies do not provide stability. All of these RP experiments would throw the economy into havoc.

I think you are missing the whole point. For many decades now we've deflated our currency (by lowering interest rates) to pretend we are offering stability. In fact we've been really fucking up as a country and now it's home to roost.

It stops working when you can't lower that value any more -- and that's where we are at.

The dollars real value is based off that interest rate. When we print money it's supposed be backed by debt. Basically the reserve says, o.k. these people want to borrow 10 billion dollars at x percent. Print it - and as we get paid back it increases the value of the next set of money we print off. Sure there will be some defaults but not more than the interest rate we are charging.

Now what we are doing is just printing money not even backed up by interest.

That's what causes inflation. It also causes us as a country to go way deeper in debt because our dollars go way down.

Now the real question is why are we doing this. It's possible that our leaders are just selfish idiots or it's just as possible they are trying to destroy this nation. That destruction gives democrats power, bankers more money, the military/industrial complex big bucks, etc...

So when you need 400 dollars to buy a loaf of bread you lose. BUT the government wins.

BECAUSE

While the dollar is worthless they will do a massive "new deal" type thing. And using debt they will flood trillions into the economy (making that bread 600 a loaf). Then they will jack the interest rates up for borrowing and slash spending.

Slowly the value of a dollar will rise. When you borrowed an ass load at a dollar worth pennies - when it's back up to a dollar value it's like free money.

Except YOU paid for it. Your family will suffer, etc...

Here is an alternative for you - and what Ron Paul's direction heads.

1.) The federal reserve can stuff it - it's dollar type 1. They can tweak that interest rate and do what they want. We don't control them now either - it's NOT a branch of our government. It's a bank that SOUNDS like it's part of the government. You however MUST spend this money to buy anything. You can't spend peso's or gold.

2.) A new U.S. government dollar backed by gold/silver/real wealth. Our country benefits from interest instead of a bank. It's our ass on the line for the fed reserve money - this way we benefit.

3.) Actually spend gold and silver as cash.

So number 3 protects your liberty. If you have gold, and I'm willing to accept it as payment. We should have the right. Number 2 protects our sovereignty as a nation. We shouldn't be beholden to a bank as a country.

Number 1 can't go away fast. It would destabilize things.


Now I know I'm not a great 'point maker' like some of the folks on this forum. I probably shouldn't be advocating for RP :) However, I'm older than a lot of you. I know that when I open up the classifieds in the paper I see people working doing jobs I did 20 years ago and making less BEFORE inflation. Once you add that inflation in, they aren't making shit.

So the real question is.......

When you work for an hour should you end up with money in your pocket? Or should you just have enough for a tube of cheap toothpaste?

I know where I stand. I don't care about Religion in politics, I don't care about abortion (that can all be states rights). I do care about my kids future - and it's looking pretty grim. Voting for one more shill won't fix anything.

RP at least has a vision for the country - one he's advocated for a long time. It's one I can get behind and one that has a better chance of giving my kids a future.
 
Your only concern is uncertainty, and yep, we don't have a crystal ball that shows how the economy would react to a RP presidency or how israel would do as a sovereign nation as opposed to our pet.

We can look at history to see the failure of our current system. Pay close attention to US post Nixon taking us off of the gold standard.

We'll never get the fed on any kind of standard, it's impossible, the only solution is competition and let the people decide which holds more value.

Just a few rebuttals for other readers because it looks like your mind is made up

As far as you bank argument goes - I am good with what you have said - but it has nothing to do with RP.

But it has everything to do with working for good inside a corrupt system. Free your mind.



RP advocates are not going to change the extreme voters of either side - maybe just some independents.

independent voters can be up to 30% of the votes cast, more than a few I'd say, and plenty to sway an election.

And as far as extremes go, he appeals strongly to blue republicans and the anti-war left as well as the religious right, veterens (current and future), and many other groups. Some will pick apart his policies as you did, most americans are stupid and would vote because they saw the Ron Paul blimp over Heinz field on monday night football.

Besides, put him in a debate with Obama and I'm pretty sure RP won't be the one leaving the stage in tears.

RP will not be able to do anything he advocates and he will ostracize everyone because he is a smart ass that always feels he is the smartest in the room.

He's a smart ass because they've been laughing for 30 years while he's been right. Besides, I think the smartest person in the country should lead. I'd vote for Einstein and I'm sure he was one quirky fuck.

You are wrong on this. The market needs a stable system of exchange to function properly. Multiple competing currencies do not provide stability. All of these RP experiments would throw the economy into havoc.

In one hand we have a failing currency, and we all know it

In the other we have something else......

Which has the best chance for survival? If this were evolution, fed bucks would be extinct.

I do not know exactly how it works - because I am really do not know - but it seems inflation hurts the lending class much more than the lower classes (borrower classes) even though RP claims the opposite.

As far as bank profits go, teh inflation is irrelivant because 90% of the loan costs them nothing. You buy a house for $100k and get a loan from the bank. The bank puts up $10k. If you default, the bank writes that $90k off and takes the deed for your house ... who won here?



You are more cynical than I. The news influences the rulers - yes. But if RP were less of a smart ass he would get more support. You see no one likes a no it all smart ass nerd. Sure he is smart - so what. He's still an ass and not likeable.

Rand is a better "politician" (read: slick speaker) than his father. So there is hope for the future even if you do think the gentile doctor is too harsh on the people who have frauded the American people for decades.



I never studied him much until my last post. I will say that he has some good ideas - but he comes off like an idiot.

I see all the RP lovers enjoying the YouTube video of hm and Bernake over "if gold is money" - as far as I am concerned RP looks like a dumb ass jerk and Bernake, though he paused, won the discussion.

Hmmm, talk about a cocky dumb ass jerk

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_N0Cwg5iN4"]Greenspan: US Can Pay Any Debt It Has Because It Can Print Money To Pay It - YouTube[/ame]

Is there any place you can point me that shows RP as someone that can govern?

I'm resisting dropping a link to teh city founded in his name since he doesn't endorse it.